[Mild Rover]

Re: Wealth re-distribution : Mon Dec 31, 2018 3:33 pm  

Sal Paradise wrote:

Therein lies the issue with the left - its about the elite left having access to things they would readily deny others. You cannot deny the human spirit's desire to better itself through hardwork/risk/innovation.

Are you calling the Labour Party out for hypocrisy? For actually being right lovers while masquerading as do-gooders? That, I can see that... to a point.

Or are you suggesting that Tories want to reward hard work? Or just that they’re more open about being lovers? Because they don’t make much of an effort to hide it?

At best they might have some patronising affection for those ‘ordinary’ people who know how to tug the forelock appropriately, but basically they despise the general public. Powerful tories work (well, probably direct somebody else to work) to maintain the privileges of the privileged, stamping on any efforts at economic betterment from the rest of society where necessary - or just for shits and giggles, in the case of somebody like Boris Johnson. They’ll tell you class war is outdated, but they never disarmed - that’s their lie, but it’s obvious enough that it’s arguably not even dishonest.

Anyhoo, the UK’s still entrenched class system and it’s bloated and poorly incentivised financial system are two local issues, we could look to fix. If we were rich and powerful, in which case we’d be much less motivated to do so, having likely been ruined by our power and wealth.

Re: Wealth re-distribution : Mon Dec 31, 2018 3:41 pm  

Bullseye wrote:

Can't see that happening unless Labour party membership starts to be made up of centre-ists. At the moment the membership is more Corbynistas. Unlike in the past the membership has a greater say than ever before.

Then we will be waiting a long time to see a Labour Govt

Re: Wealth re-distribution : Mon Dec 31, 2018 4:23 pm  

GUBRATS wrote:

Then we will be waiting a long time to see a Labour Govt

Why do you say that?

Labour and the Tories are neck and neck in the polls at around 40% each. Historically 40% would win you an election, but with Lib Dem and UKIP vote share completely collapsed, obviously they can’t both win.

When you factor in the Welsh and Scottish parties would back Labour over the tories, that should get them over the line.

An election next year is extremely likely, just look at the odds on offer at the bookies, it’s about evens.

Re: Wealth re-distribution : Mon Dec 31, 2018 4:46 pm  

Sal Paradise wrote:

I am a Tory voter but I am concerned about the inequality of wealth in this country.

I’m a turkey but I vote for Christmas, love off.

Re: Wealth re-distribution : Mon Dec 31, 2018 9:40 pm  

The Gov keep stressing that hard work pays.....Of course it does . I believe anyone who works hard should be rewarded anyway. They use that as if they are doing you a favour. e.g. Imagine you've just been grafting for 4 days on 12 hour shifts,and they say they are rewarding hard work. No they are not,you are rewarding yourself for working bleeding hard for nearly 50 hours. BTW - I'm certainly no Labour supporter either.

Re: Wealth re-distribution : Mon Dec 31, 2018 9:42 pm  

Sir Kevin Sinfield wrote:

No, I only ever left the virtual terrace and still do not post on that forum.

Why?

Re: Wealth re-distribution : Tue Jan 01, 2019 9:07 am  

Mild Rover wrote:

Are you calling the Labour Party out for hypocrisy? For actually being right lovers while masquerading as do-gooders? That, I can see that... to a point.

Or are you suggesting that Tories want to reward hard work? Or just that they’re more open about being lovers? Because they don’t make much of an effort to hide it?

At best they might have some patronising affection for those ‘ordinary’ people who know how to tug the forelock appropriately, but basically they despise the general public. Powerful tories work (well, probably direct somebody else to work) to maintain the privileges of the privileged, stamping on any efforts at economic betterment from the rest of society where necessary - or just for shits and giggles, in the case of somebody like Boris Johnson. They’ll tell you class war is outdated, but they never disarmed - that’s their lie, but it’s obvious enough that it’s arguably not even dishonest.

Anyhoo, the UK’s still entrenched class system and it’s bloated and poorly incentivised financial system are two local issues, we could look to fix. If we were rich and powerful, in which case we’d be much less motivated to do so, having likely been ruined by our power and wealth.

In a capitalist system anyone can rise to the top its about ability and the apetite for risk e.g. Bill Gates, James Dyson, Larry Ellison, Jeff Bezos etc. - none of these ultra rich individuals came from high society they achieved what they have through hard work, innovation and risk. These individuals would have never prospered and neither would society under a Socialist styled regime. A class war is a myth - anyone with the nerve and an idea can prosper - the toffs have to put their money somewhere to generate a return to run their country pile.

One thing is certain if Corbyn gets in personal taxes will rise - the idea that the wealthy who already contribute significant % of all income tax will contribute more will not happen and increases in corporation tax will see more avoidance. So the man in the street will see his/her net income diminish - the money has to come from somewhere to funds all these industries they are going to re-nationalise.

You will see a pandering to the unions - they own the Labour party and they will be expecting payback - you think your trains are bad now you haven't seen anything yet.

Its a simple choice - do you want the state to make more choices for you i.e. where you buy your gas/electricity or do you want the ability to decide for yourself? Anyone who thinks utility costs will come down when/if they are re-nationalised is delusional.

If Labour had a leader like Umanna they would walk the election the only reason they will not trounce the Tories is Corbyn.

Back to the original point will a Labour government re-distribute the national income in a fairer way - not a chance in my view because all monies they generate will be wasted on pampering to pet Socialistic ideals like state-ownership and all the negative externalities that brings.

Re: Wealth re-distribution : Tue Jan 01, 2019 10:03 am  

Sal Paradise wrote:

In a capitalist system anyone can rise to the top its about ability and the apetite for risk e.g. Bill Gates, James Dyson, Larry Ellison, Jeff Bezos etc. - none of these ultra rich individuals came from high society they achieved what they have through hard work, innovation and risk. These individuals would have never prospered and neither would society under a Socialist styled regime. A class war is a myth - anyone with the nerve and an idea can prosper - the toffs have to put their money somewhere to generate a return to run their country pile.

One thing is certain if Corbyn gets in personal taxes will rise - the idea that the wealthy who already contribute significant % of all income tax will contribute more will not happen and increases in corporation tax will see more avoidance. So the man in the street will see his/her net income diminish - the money has to come from somewhere to funds all these industries they are going to re-nationalise.

You will see a pandering to the unions - they own the Labour party and they will be expecting payback - you think your trains are bad now you haven't seen anything yet.

Its a simple choice - do you want the state to make more choices for you i.e. where you buy your gas/electricity or do you want the ability to decide for yourself? Anyone who thinks utility costs will come down when/if they are re-nationalised is delusional.

If Labour had a leader like Umanna they would walk the election the only reason they will not trounce the Tories is Corbyn.

Back to the original point will a Labour government re-distribute the national income in a fairer way - not a chance in my view because all monies they generate will be wasted on pampering to pet Socialistic ideals like state-ownership and all the negative externalities that brings.

It's the 1st of January.
Check under your bed this evening before retiring.
Have nice fluffy dreams about your heroic self made billionaires.
W@nk over them if that's your bag.
Stop sh!it!ng yourself about the revolution.

Re: Wealth re-distribution : Tue Jan 01, 2019 10:14 am  

WIZEB wrote:

It's the 1st of January.
Check under your bed this evening before retiring.
Have nice fluffy dreams about your heroic self made billionaires.
W@nk over them if that's your bag.
Stop sh!it!ng yourself about the revolution.

I'm not because it wont happen - keep the red flag flying

We all in it together - of course we are (sic)

Re: Wealth re-distribution : Tue Jan 01, 2019 10:19 am  

Sal Paradise wrote:

I'm not because it wont happen - keep the red flag flying

We all in it together - of course we are (sic)

Have you been doing your bit at the local food-bank and homeless shelters this Christmas?
It may help to alleviate your concerns for the disproportionate times we are living in.