Re: Brexit Anyone ? (part 3) : Sun Oct 21, 2018 6:19 pm  

MorePlaymakersNeeded wrote:

Erm, wasn't there a Northern Ireland and EIRE living side by side before we joined a trade agreement that was a smokescreen to political/legal/monetary/absolutely total European union?
Why should there be any changes to the border? I don't get it, and it does seem a ploy to delay/derail brexit.

Are you sure ?

As for delaying tactics, just nonsense but, this should have been thought about and dealt with 2 years ago and not left until the last minute.
Notwistanding the fact that Mrs May has signed her name to the "backstop" but now realises that this is going to cause her downfall and alienate either part of the Tory part or, her new best friends in The DUP.

The phrase "falling on her sword" springs to mind, poor Teresa

Re: Brexit Anyone ? (part 3) : Sun Oct 21, 2018 8:33 pm  

It's actually Cameron's sword, he must have left it behind when the vote on EU membership went rather unexpectedly and he did one. Not that it matters of course.

Re: Brexit Anyone ? (part 3) : Mon Oct 22, 2018 1:54 pm  

Boris Johnson's batty pater made a typically Johnson-esque intervention, saying on some TV show that "if the Irish want to shoot each other, they'll shoot each other."

The apple does not fall far from the inbred, xenophobic, politically myopic tree.

Re: Brexit Anyone ? (part 3) : Mon Oct 22, 2018 3:20 pm  

That is fair enough every is entitled to their opinion, I don't agree but I still don't see why a border leads directly to bloodshed?

Re: Brexit Anyone ? (part 3) : Mon Oct 22, 2018 5:37 pm  

Sal Paradise wrote:

That is fair enough every is entitled to their opinion, I don't agree but I still don't see why a border leads directly to bloodshed?

It may not BUT, if we do go back to a hard border and The Irish start bombing each other, it will be too late.
This is something that should have been debated long ago and a strategy sorted out in advance of negotiations and it really doesn't help that The Tory majority is only kept in tact.

There should have been a cross party Brexit group to help forge the best future for the country, with those involved (from all parties) committed to getting the job done.
Instead, we've had a fractured Tory party, muddling through and compromising to keep their own party in government and we look like ending up with the worst deal possible.
The one sure thing is that very few people voted for what we are likely to end up with.

Re: Brexit Anyone ? (part 3) : Tue Oct 23, 2018 6:48 am  

wrencat1873 wrote:

It may not BUT, if we do go back to a hard border and The Irish start bombing each other, it will be too late.
This is something that should have been debated long ago and a strategy sorted out in advance of negotiations and it really doesn't help that The Tory majority is only kept in tact.

There should have been a cross party Brexit group to help forge the best future for the country, with those involved (from all parties) committed to getting the job done.
Instead, we've had a fractured Tory party, muddling through and compromising to keep their own party in government and we look like ending up with the worst deal possible.
The one sure thing is that very few people voted for what we are likely to end up with.

So let's get away from the notion that a border triggers mass killing - that's a deflection.

Whoever was negotiating would have come up against the same issues - the EU cannot be seen to giving the UK and easy ride or a deal that would encourage other nations to leave. The best would have been to make a clean break, no break up monies unless a trade deal was agreed to.

Labour have shown they would have simply kept us in EU by the back door i.e. pay in the monies no influence for a trade deal.

What people wanted was: Own law making, some control of immigration and not paying billions in to cess-pit of corruption and over influence of bureaucrats who are beholden to Germany and France. That is most likely what they are going to get.

Re: Brexit Anyone ? (part 3) : Tue Oct 23, 2018 7:43 am  

Sal Paradise wrote:

Own law making

Already have it.

some control of immigration

Already have it if we choose.

not paying billions in to cess-pit of corruption and over influence of bureaucrats who are beholden to Germany and France.

Xenophobic rubbish.

Re: Brexit Anyone ? (part 3) : Tue Oct 23, 2018 7:47 am  

tigertot wrote:

Already have it.
Already have it if we choose.
Xenophobic rubbish.

Sad but true - the dishonest rhetoric of irresponsible morons like Nigel Farage has become the new reality.

Re: Brexit Anyone ? (part 3) : Tue Oct 23, 2018 9:57 am  

tigertot wrote:

Already have it.
Already have it if we choose.
Xenophobic rubbish.

One first point - so if we wanted to offer inducements to companies to base themselves here e.g. Apple and Ireland we couldn't do that if we were part of the EU. We want to change the rules on fishing in our waters?

Point two - wrong again

Point three - why should we pay in to support other nations who don't - that was a big element in the vote - e.g. the red bus - the c£10bn we pay in is not Xenophobic rubbish its a fact

Re: Brexit Anyone ? (part 3) : Tue Oct 23, 2018 11:52 am  

Sal Paradise wrote:

One first point - so if we wanted to offer inducements to companies to base themselves here e.g. Apple and Ireland we couldn't do that if we were part of the EU. We want to change the rules on fishing in our waters?

Point two - wrong again

Point three - why should we pay in to support other nations who don't - that was a big element in the vote - e.g. the red bus - the c£10bn we pay in is not Xenophobic rubbish its a fact

Regarding the £10 billion net that we contribute to the EU, do you not think that there have been annual benefits to heavily offset this figure, possibly wipe it out completely.
Business is built on stability (although we havent been too stable - or strong - since the referendum and IF we do manage to achieve some cheaper goods from elsewhere (post Brexit), we risk having additional duty applied to certain manufactured goods, should we try to sell items, incorporating these goods, back into the EU.
There COULD be some benefits if these items were for domestic consumption or used as components in manufactured goods sold outside the EU.

For manufacturing, there are huge concerns regarding export (post Brexit). Apart from the uncertainty, any additional costs, either as direct raw material increases or additional cost in moving goods would be extremely damaging to their prosperity.

We are still all relying on hope to prosper beyond our life in the EU and it still remains the biggest gamble for the UK economy in the last 100 years.