Re: More Tory Lies : Thu Nov 21, 2019 8:56 am  

Cronus wrote:

What happened in Parliament in the last few months isn't surprising at all. Something had to give. When so many perfidious MPs are doing their best to frustrate the result of the referendum, the usual rules don't apply. 400 years ago they'd have been burned at the stake.

What I do genuinely find funny is the growing levels of aggression and frustration on the left. It's palpable on here and elsewhere. The devoted simply cannot cope with the fact most people will not vote for Corbyn, or that Swinson is a failure. Maybe if Jezza actually answered questions, condemned anti-UK/West terrorist groups, stopped promising unicorns and straightened his fookin glasses, he might get somewhere.

You really do have to laugh when Leavers keep banging on about "frustrating the result of the referendum", it's just hilarious.
We had a referendum with a binary in / out vote but, the myriad of promises made bey the numerous different factions voting "leave" makes a satisfactory solution totally impossible and you know it so, the faux outrage and froth certainly seems to be more severe when you hear Farage and some of the Tory right wing clique talking, way more than those on the left.

Just to remind you that we had the "no deal" brigade, the "soft Brexit" and the Labour "Brexit with a customs union" - viewed by many as not being Brexit at all and then we had 48.4% for remain.

3 years on from the vote, with some of the hyperbole and exaggeration removed, we know that any "leave" agreement will leave us all worse off not "project fear" but nailed on fact (it's just the level of contraction to the ecconomy that is up for debate).

Corbyn wont show his personal views, primarily because IF and it's a very unlikely if, Labour were to win, he recognises that depending on the result of the "confirmatory referendum", he would still have to lead his party and the country and whilst this weakens his current position, it could be a sensible move long term.

As for the original point that I made, regarding the schoolyard capers from the Tories, it's just pathetic and for ANY ruling party to run with those tactics just demonstrates what type of government Boris wants to run , back in the common room of Eton, putting dog food on the dining table and replacing lemonade with mickey, oh, but it's all so much fun.

Dont know about "growing a pair" but they certainly need to grow up and take the task of moving the country forward somewhat more seriously.

Re: More Tory Lies : Thu Nov 21, 2019 9:15 am  

wrencat1873 wrote:

You really do have to laugh when Leavers keep banging on about "frustrating the result of the referendum", it's just hilarious.
We had a referendum with a binary in / out vote but, the myriad of promises made bey the numerous different factions voting "leave" makes a satisfactory solution totally impossible and you know it so, the faux outrage and froth certainly seems to be more severe when you hear Farage and some of the Tory right wing clique talking, way more than those on the left.

Just to remind you that we had the "no deal" brigade, the "soft Brexit" and the Labour "Brexit with a customs union" - viewed by many as not being Brexit at all and then we had 48.4% for remain.

3 years on from the vote, with some of the hyperbole and exaggeration removed, we know that any "leave" agreement will leave us all worse off not "project fear" but nailed on fact (it's just the level of contraction to the ecconomy that is up for debate).

Corbyn wont show his personal views, primarily because IF and it's a very unlikely if, Labour were to win, he recognises that depending on the result of the "confirmatory referendum", he would still have to lead his party and the country and whilst this weakens his current position, it could be a sensible move long term.

As for the original point that I made, regarding the schoolyard capers from the Tories, it's just pathetic and for ANY ruling party to run with those tactics just demonstrates what type of government Boris wants to run , back in the common room of Eton, putting dog food on the dining table and replacing lemonade with mickey, oh, but it's all so much fun.

Dont know about "growing a pair" but they certainly need to grow up and take the task of moving the country forward somewhat more seriously.

What is a laugh is Labour saying they would stand by the result of a referendum but simply want to ignore the result of the last referendum.

Corbyn is supposed to be a leader - so surely he has to dictate the direction of travel - that's what leaders do they lead? It makes him look very weak indeed.

The Tories are simply livening up what has become a pretty dull election campaign - yes maybe some might see it as flippant but even the cabinet aren't taking it seriously. What matters is not what happens on Twitter it's what happens on TV, radio and in the press.

What needs further examination is the claims of these guys. Dawn Buttler yesterday - 3,000 on the streets in Brent alone, there are only 5,000 in the whole country. Angela Rayner we will build 100,000 council house every year for 5 years. That 2,000 a week - they will be lucky to build 100,000 in the life of Parliament. Boris - NI cuts will give £500 when in fact it will give £85. Libdems not leaving the EU will give a £50bn bounce to the economy. Its about time this all calmed down and some rationality, responsibility and achievability were shown by these guys.

Re: More Tory Lies : Thu Nov 21, 2019 9:25 am  

AXE2GRIND wrote:

Actually it's not. Twitter has said if they do it again they'll be suspended, so they were wrong and have been told as much. As for "social media" being taken too seriously.......are you for real?

Absolutely - I follow most of the bigger political hitters in the UK and they are all as bad as each other - nobody worse than Corbyn and McDonald for spreading fake news. Perhaps if the leading figures in both parties raised the quality of debate it would help.

Sadly none of them want because their policies have more hole than a sieve.

Re: More Tory Lies : Thu Nov 21, 2019 9:50 am  

Sal Paradise wrote:

Absolutely - I follow most of the bigger political hitters in the UK and they are all as bad as each other - nobody worse than Corbyn and McDonald for spreading fake news. Perhaps if the leading figures in both parties raised the quality of debate it would help.

Sadly none of them want because their policies have more hole than a sieve.

Much like at a RL game, you aren't watching both sides.
The absolute litany of lies, mis quotes and irregular behaviour since Boris teamed up with Cummigs and took on the top job is absolutely unprecedented and just disgraceful - I hope that he is making you proud, I'm not
I'm sure that you know this (as it's impossible to argue against) but, just as we expect from the Conservatives, you are more than happy to look the other way.
There was a time when someone behaving so erratically would have been clamed down by the more experienced MP's but, Boris seems to have got rid of any "sensible" MP's and filled his team with idiot's and yes men (and women).
As I said in another post, we now have the political equivalent of the Sunday Sport.

Re: More Tory Lies : Thu Nov 21, 2019 12:02 pm  

wrencat1873 wrote:

Much like at a RL game, you aren't watching both sides.
The absolute litany of lies, mis quotes and irregular behaviour since Boris teamed up with Cummigs and took on the top job is absolutely unprecedented and just disgraceful - I hope that he is making you proud, I'm not
I'm sure that you know this (as it's impossible to argue against) but, just as we expect from the Conservatives, you are more than happy to look the other way.
There was a time when someone behaving so erratically would have been clamed down by the more experienced MP's but, Boris seems to have got rid of any "sensible" MP's and filled his team with idiot's and yes men (and women).
As I said in another post, we now have the political equivalent of the Sunday Sport.

So which are the lies that concern you the most?

The previous cabinet had a chancellor would simply would not spend any money to the detriment of all citizens - you can't have it both ways - either fiscal control and its consequences are OK or there not

He had a number of MPs who simply wanted to disrupt the Brexit process - this needed to be addressed - when you can members of your own party actively engaging with EU against the agreed party line what do you expect Boris to do? In business you would sack them.

Who are the voices of reason that he has got rid of - Ken Clarke who else? How many of the current cabinet were in May's cabinet - quite a few.

Now let's look at Labour - Corbyn has simply surrounded himself with hard left MPs who share Lansman's vision of what the UK should be - he is far more dangerous than Cummins but to take your RL analogy you only see your side playing.

Re: More Tory Lies : Thu Nov 21, 2019 12:10 pm  

Sal Paradise wrote:

So which are the lies that concern you the most?

The previous cabinet had a chancellor would simply would not spend any money to the detriment of all citizens - you can't have it both ways - either fiscal control and its consequences are OK or there not

He had a number of MPs who simply wanted to disrupt the Brexit process - this needed to be addressed - when you can members of your own party actively engaging with EU against the agreed party line what do you expect Boris to do? In business you would sack them.

Who are the voices of reason that he has got rid of - Ken Clarke who else? How many of the current cabinet were in May's cabinet - quite a few.

Now let's look at Labour - Corbyn has simply surrounded himself with hard left MPs who share Lansman's vision of what the UK should be - he is far more dangerous than Cummins but to take your RL analogy you only see your side playing.

The lies which concern me most are the ones coming from Johnsons mouth.
Has ANYTHING that he has said do far actually been true ??

Brexit done by 30th October DO OR DIE, he's still living
I dont want an election
Brexit will be done bey end of 2020
20,000 new and additional policemen
20 new hospitals
Proroguing parliament
New queens speech

I could keep going, he literally cant help himself and he seemed to have issues with his new NI calculations as well but, the difference between £90 and £500 a year will be utterly irrelevant to him.

He needs to get back to practical jokes and playing the fool, which may be his only attribute.

Re: More Tory Lies : Thu Nov 21, 2019 12:43 pm  

wrencat1873 wrote:

The lies which concern me most are the ones coming from Johnsons mouth.
Has ANYTHING that he has said do far actually been true ??

Brexit done by 30th October DO OR DIE, he's still living
I dont want an election
Brexit will be done bey end of 2020
20,000 new and additional policemen
20 new hospitals
Proroguing parliament
New queens speech

I could keep going, he literally cant help himself and he seemed to have issues with his new NI calculations as well but, the difference between £90 and £500 a year will be utterly irrelevant to him.

He needs to get back to practical jokes and playing the fool, which may be his only attribute.

It wasn't his fault that parliament passed the Benn act that cut the rug from under his feet. Then backed by the speaker parliament were simply not going to back the bill without significant changes i.e. a customs union and a single market so not really his doing.

No reason it cannot be completed by 2020 - especially if he has a significant majority

Policemen - he has started on that he never said it would be done before Christmas

New Hospitals - they are on with it - again he never said it would instant

Proroguing parliament - bad move for me - he knew exactly what he was doing and why - he definitely lied about that

Queens speech became redundant when they blocked Brexit - parliament needed dissolving at that point.

Just because we are having an election doesn't mean he actually wanted one - big risk, Corbyn is a very experienced campaigner. Labour wanted an election but turned down the opportunity many times so are they liars too?

Re: More Tory Lies : Thu Nov 21, 2019 1:04 pm  

Sal Paradise wrote:

It wasn't his fault that parliament passed the Benn act that cut the rug from under his feet. Then backed by the speaker parliament were simply not going to back the bill without significant changes i.e. a customs union and a single market so not really his doing.

No reason it cannot be completed by 2020 - especially if he has a significant majority

Policemen - he has started on that he never said it would be done before Christmas

New Hospitals - they are on with it - again he never said it would instant

Proroguing parliament - bad move for me - he knew exactly what he was doing and why - he definitely lied about that

Queens speech became redundant when they blocked Brexit - parliament needed dissolving at that point.

Just because we are having an election doesn't mean he actually wanted one - big risk, Corbyn is a very experienced campaigner. Labour wanted an election but turned down the opportunity many times so are they liars too?

So, you actually agree on half of the stuff and the remainder hasn't been done and is not likely to.
Fancy a charity wager on the number of hospitals or policemen, although we'd have to put a time limit on as I'm the wrong side of 50

Re: More Tory Lies : Thu Nov 21, 2019 2:03 pm  

wrencat1873 wrote:

So, you actually agree on half of the stuff and the remainder hasn't been done and is not likely to.
Fancy a charity wager on the number of hospitals or policemen, although we'd have to put a time limit on as I'm the wrong side of 50

You are not the only one

No problem with a charity bet £50 is fine and it does depend on who wins the election.

If the Tories win - 10,000 extra police by 2020

New hospitals - it takes >5 years to build one - so how many new hospitals are in construction by the end of this parliament. I say 5

If Labour win
Not a chance they will have built 100,000 new homes before 2020 - even 2021.

I guarantee they will not have nationalised anything by end of 2020.

Re: More Tory Lies : Thu Nov 21, 2019 2:13 pm  

Sal Paradise wrote:

You are not the only one

No problem with a charity bet £50 is fine and it does depend on who wins the election.

If the Tories win - 10,000 extra police by 2020

New hospitals - it takes >5 years to build one - so how many new hospitals are in construction by the end of this parliament. I say 5

If Labour win
Not a chance they will have built 100,000 new homes before 2020 - even 2021.

I guarantee they will not have nationalised anything by end of 2020.

I said that I was the wrong side of 50, not about to croak !