FORUMS FORUMS






RLFANS.COM
Celebrating
25 years service to
the Rugby League
Community!

   WWW.RLFANS.COM • View topic - Andrew Mitchell - Update
::Off-topic discussion.
User avatar
RankPostsTeam
All Time Great47951No
Team
Selected
JoinedServiceReputation
May 10 200223 yearsN/A
OnlineLast PostLast Page
6th Aug 17 19:0327th Jul 17 17:56LINK
Milestone Posts
40000
50000
Milestone Years
0510 1520 2530
Location
Die Metropole
Signature
"You are working for Satan." Kirkstaller

"Dare to know!" Immanuel Kant

"Do not take life too seriously. You will never get out of it alive" Elbert Hubbard

"We are all in the gutter, but some of us are looking at the stars." Oscar Wilde

The Voluptuous Manifesto – thoughts on all sorts of stuff.

Re: Andrew Mitchell - Update : Tue Feb 11, 2014 1:22 pm  
Lord Elpers wrote:
Why do you consider posts that disagree with you to be trolling?


I don't.

Lord Elpers wrote:
In fact many of my posts have been to speak out against trolls and character assassins of those with politically opposite views. eg Mrs T, Andew Mitchell, the PM, George Osborne etc. I suppose you have never been guilty of that have you?


Many of your posts show a determination to avoid facts and, indeed, to rubbish points that others make because they're not convenient for your 'argument'.

Lord Elpers wrote:
Assuming you have time to fit in work amongst in your many forum blogs - what you you do then?


My "many forum blogs"? :lol:

Y'see, that – as with your rather pathetic comments about Jerry's work life and your claims (which you cannot back up) that he only ever rubbishes one political party – is yet another perfect illustration of your continued lack of interest in facts.

Oh: and I'm a self-employed journalist, writer and photographer, and my 'order book' is rather nicely full.
User avatar
RankPostsTeam
Player Coach362No
Team
Selected
JoinedServiceReputation
Aug 16 200816 yearsN/A
OnlineLast PostLast Page
20th Feb 16 16:5920th Feb 16 12:29LINK
Milestone Posts
250
500
Milestone Years
0510 1520 2530
Location
Up North

Re: Andrew Mitchell - Update : Tue Feb 11, 2014 7:47 pm  
Chris28 wrote:
Just out of interest, what RL team do you support Elpers?


Is it relevant 28?
User avatar
RankPostsTeam
International Star3605No
Team
Selected
JoinedServiceReputation
Jul 09 201212 yearsN/A
OnlineLast PostLast Page
20th May 16 14:5420th May 16 10:16LINK
Milestone Posts
2500
5000
Milestone Years
0510 1520 2530
Location
Leeds
Signature
Someday everything is gonna be different, when I paint my masterpiece
----------------------------------------------------------
Online art gallery, selling original landscape artwork
----------------------------------------------------------
JerryChicken - The Blog
----------------------------------------------------------

Re: Andrew Mitchell - Update : Tue Feb 11, 2014 8:12 pm  
Lord Elpers wrote:
"work online all day" Do you regard forums as work then?


When one of your businesses is based on them, yes, and I also have this uncanny knack of being able to browse one screen whilst working on another, I suppose thats how I came to be involved in this software mularky in the first place.


I haven't read anything else that you wrote.
User avatar
RankPostsTeam
Player Coach362No
Team
Selected
JoinedServiceReputation
Aug 16 200816 yearsN/A
OnlineLast PostLast Page
20th Feb 16 16:5920th Feb 16 12:29LINK
Milestone Posts
250
500
Milestone Years
0510 1520 2530
Location
Up North

Re: Andrew Mitchell - Update : Tue Feb 11, 2014 8:44 pm  
Mintball wrote:
I don't..


Then please give an example of my trolling to support your claim?

Mintball wrote:
Many of your posts show a determination to avoid facts and, indeed, to rubbish points that others make because they're not convenient for your 'argument'..


Please give examples to support you claim? Your statement can be equally applied to you. If you read my posts you will see I do use facts and try to forensically form my arguments.

Mintball wrote:
My "many forum blogs"? :lol: .
So you think 76 postings per week is not many?


Mintball wrote:
Y'see, that – as with your rather pathetic comments about Jerry's work life and your claims (which you cannot back up) that he only ever rubbishes one political party – is yet another perfect illustration of your continued lack of interest in facts. .


The Chicken offered another poster, that he could provide links to prove his political even handedness. In the interests of "facts" I asked to see the links but the Chicken said he was too busy working and invited me to sift through his 2900 postings. I pointed out that 2900 in 6 months doesn't leave much time for work (his 100 add posting per week even beat your output)

Terms I used included "most" and majority and not as you state "he only ever rubbishes one politicall party". For someone who "claims" I avoid facts you have just given your own "illustration of a continued interest in facts" yourself.

JC has also failed to pruduce the evidence I requested to support some of his unsubstantiated political claims.

Mintball wrote:
Oh: and I'm a self-employed journalist, writer and photographer, and my 'order book' is rather nicely full.


Well done. Do you get your material from forums?
User avatar
RankPostsTeam
In The Arms of 13 Angels17898
JoinedServiceReputation
Oct 19 200321 yearsN/A
OnlineLast PostLast Page
3rd Mar 20 10:2927th Aug 19 12:42LINK
Milestone Posts
15000
20000
Milestone Years
0510 1520 2530
Location
Packed like sardines, in a tin
Signature
2005 Challenge Cup

To reconcile respect with practicality, what is the optimum speed for a hearse?

Re: Andrew Mitchell - Update : Tue Feb 11, 2014 9:20 pm  
Lord Elpers wrote:
Is it relevant 28?

Just interested
User avatar
RankPostsTeam
All Time Great47951No
Team
Selected
JoinedServiceReputation
May 10 200223 yearsN/A
OnlineLast PostLast Page
6th Aug 17 19:0327th Jul 17 17:56LINK
Milestone Posts
40000
50000
Milestone Years
0510 1520 2530
Location
Die Metropole
Signature
"You are working for Satan." Kirkstaller

"Dare to know!" Immanuel Kant

"Do not take life too seriously. You will never get out of it alive" Elbert Hubbard

"We are all in the gutter, but some of us are looking at the stars." Oscar Wilde

The Voluptuous Manifesto – thoughts on all sorts of stuff.

Re: Andrew Mitchell - Update : Wed Feb 12, 2014 6:56 am  
Lord Elpers wrote:
... So you think 76 postings per week is not many?


I think that you don't know the difference between a forum and a blog. :lol:

Lord Elpers wrote:
The Chicken offered another poster, that he could provide links to prove his political even handedness. In the interests of "facts" I asked to see the links but the Chicken said he was too busy working and invited me to sift through his 2900 postings. I pointed out that 2900 in 6 months doesn't leave much time for work (his 100 add posting per week even beat your output)


If you're going to make claims, it's up to you to find the proof on which to base them. Don't expect others to run around at your beck and call to find the evidence for you. Do it yourself.

And as for the time it takes to make a post – goodness: what an incredibly silly little comment. Does it really take you hours to come up with a single contribution, meaning that you imagine that 100 (say) posts over seven days would leave 'little time for work' out of (say) a 35-hour week? Don't judge everyone else by your own sluggishness. :lol:

Mind, you're not even correct on that point. JC has been a member since July 2012 and has made 2,848 posts – that data is right under his avatar: you don't have to hunt for it. Let's make it simple and call that 18 months – thus 547 days (rounded down for ease), making it 5.20 posts a day or just 36.44 per week.

Lord Elpers wrote:
JC has also failed to pruduce the evidence I requested to support some of his unsubstantiated political claims.


It's either there or it's not. If you're so interested, go and look for it.

Lord Elpers wrote:
Well done. Do you get your material from forums?


Another crass, meaningless little comment, which also illustrates a lack of understanding of what my work entails. And you wonder why people consider you a troll. :lol:
Ajw71 
User avatar
RankPostsTeam
Player Coach1978No
Team
Selected
JoinedServiceReputation
Feb 23 200619 yearsN/A
OnlineLast PostLast Page
19th Dec 23 20:2714th Dec 19 14:13LINK
Milestone Posts
1000
2500
Milestone Years
0510 1520 2530

Re: Andrew Mitchell - Update : Wed Feb 12, 2014 8:05 am  
Mintball wrote:
If you're going to make claims, it's up to you to find the proof on which to base them. Don't expect others to run around at your beck and call to find the evidence for you. Do it yourself.



:lol:

Ever heard of the expression 'practice what you preach'?

Mintball wrote:
And you wonder why people consider you a troll. :lol:


'people' don't. Just you. The same as every other poster you disagree with. Time to take a look in the mirror at who is the real troll.
User avatar
RankPostsTeam
All Time Great47951No
Team
Selected
JoinedServiceReputation
May 10 200223 yearsN/A
OnlineLast PostLast Page
6th Aug 17 19:0327th Jul 17 17:56LINK
Milestone Posts
40000
50000
Milestone Years
0510 1520 2530
Location
Die Metropole
Signature
"You are working for Satan." Kirkstaller

"Dare to know!" Immanuel Kant

"Do not take life too seriously. You will never get out of it alive" Elbert Hubbard

"We are all in the gutter, but some of us are looking at the stars." Oscar Wilde

The Voluptuous Manifesto – thoughts on all sorts of stuff.

Re: Andrew Mitchell - Update : Wed Feb 12, 2014 8:36 am  
Ajw71 wrote:
:lol:

Ever heard of the expression 'practice what you preach'?


Examples?

Or were you planning to go back to the Gidiot story, where you and your fellow Gidiot bum-lickers were priovided with the basis for the story, but stood there squealing like little brats that it wasn't enough? :lol:

Ajw71 wrote:
'people' don't. Just you. The same as every other poster you disagree with. Time to take a look in the mirror at who is the real troll.


If you'd bothered to read assorted threads, you'd know that I am not the only poster here who considers Elpers to be a troll.

And to repeat: I do not call anyone a troll who I disagree with.

I suggest that you find some evidence to back that up. Indeed, perhaps you can find a poll?
User avatar
RankPostsTeam
International Star3605No
Team
Selected
JoinedServiceReputation
Jul 09 201212 yearsN/A
OnlineLast PostLast Page
20th May 16 14:5420th May 16 10:16LINK
Milestone Posts
2500
5000
Milestone Years
0510 1520 2530
Location
Leeds
Signature
Someday everything is gonna be different, when I paint my masterpiece
----------------------------------------------------------
Online art gallery, selling original landscape artwork
----------------------------------------------------------
JerryChicken - The Blog
----------------------------------------------------------

Re: Andrew Mitchell - Update : Wed Feb 12, 2014 9:24 am  
There is an honest account of what happened on the night in question in todays Times (assuming that you subscribe) as stated by one of the fours officers on duty at the gate that night and who retired one month later as scheduled after 30 service.

The fact that he can only speak so openly having left the police force and the fact that he believes that the Police Federation hijacked something that should have been sorted out with a couple of conversations and an apology the next morning just about sums it all up for me.
User avatar
RankPostsTeam
Player Coach362No
Team
Selected
JoinedServiceReputation
Aug 16 200816 yearsN/A
OnlineLast PostLast Page
20th Feb 16 16:5920th Feb 16 12:29LINK
Milestone Posts
250
500
Milestone Years
0510 1520 2530
Location
Up North

Re: Andrew Mitchell - Update : Thu Feb 13, 2014 8:33 am  
JerryChicken wrote:
There is an honest account of what happened on the night in question in todays Times (assuming that you subscribe) as stated by one of the fours officers on duty at the gate that night and who retired one month later as scheduled after 30 service.

The fact that he can only speak so openly having left the police force and the fact that he believes that the Police Federation hijacked something that should have been sorted out with a couple of conversations and an apology the next morning just about sums it all up for me.


You often use the word "honest" without any knowledge of whether in fact it is honest. Because this account was critical of the police federation (most reasonable observers are now equally critical) does not mean exPC Richardson's account is wholly accurate.

Consider:
'The Times carries an interview with Ian Richardson, one of the police officers manning the gates at Downing Street at the time of the incident with Andrew Mitchell back in September 2012. It bears the headline “Truth about Plebgate by Downing Street police officer”.

The Times headline and article are wrong. We will never know the truth about Plebgate. It is an affair that boils down to the accounts of two men. PC Toby Rowlands, who claims Andrew Mitchell called the police f–––––– plebs” and the former chief whip himself, who denies it. There is no definitive evidence to categorically support or rebut either man’s case. All that really matters is who you believe.

Ian Richardson believes Toby Rowlands. According to the Times, “Mr Richardson, 50, who has retired from the Metropolitan Police, said he believed that Mr Mitchell called the officers “f–––––– plebs” as claimed by one of his colleagues in the original police log”.

Unfortunately, as with just about every other account of what happened that evening, Mr Richardson’s version of events – or at least his version as reported in the Times – does not quite tally with the facts. Indeed, his story does not even remain consistent with itself.

The first thing to note is that Ian Richardson claims he did not hear Andrew Mitchell call anyone anything. The Times is very clear on that. “He did not hear the exchange but said that PC Toby Rowland immediately recounted the contentious phrases”, they report. Andrew Mitchell was supposedly verbally abusing a police officer with such ferocity he was threatened with arrest. But his colleague, a few yards away, heard nothing.

Actually that’s not true. The Times, and Mr Richardson’s log of the account, say he heard nothing. But Richardson himself then contradicts himself and claims “he did hear PC Rowland say 'Please don’t swear at me'. In his log he says he didn’t hear the conversation between Andrew Mitchell and PC Toby Rowlands. In the Times he said he heard some of it. In his statement to the Times he said he was unable to hear Andrew Mitchell swearing “Best learn your f–––––– place … you lot don’t run this f–––––– government … You’re f–––––– plebs”. But he claims he was able to hear his colleague calmly admonishing Mr Mitchell with the words “please don’t swear at me”.

But again, what was said, and what was heard, is ultimately a matter for conjecture. There is no audio record.

But there is a video record. And it is crystal clear. According to the Times, Mr Richardson said that as the altercation (which he claimed not to have heard) was under way, “[he] walked over to see what was happening. As he arrived, Mr Mitchell was already pushing his bicycle along the path to the exit gate. “What happened there?” Mr Richardson asked his colleague. He says PC Rowland immediately recounted the version of the exchange "from which he has never wavered”.

As I type, there is video footage of the entire incident sitting on various sites on the internet. It shows Andrew Mitchell as he pushes his bike along the path towards the exit gate. Mr Richardson does not arrive before he reaches the gate. He does not stop and ask “what happened here”. PC Rowlands does not stop, turn to his colleague and immediately recount his version of what happened.

This is the problem with Plebgate. Time and time and time again we have seen police officers give statements about what supposedly happened. And time and time and time again those statements have been shown to be inconsistent with the facts.

So we had PC Keith Wallis’s statement that he had been at the gates of Downing Street and witnessed the entire incident. It wasn’t true. We had the statement of three members of the Police Federation who met Andrew Mitchell and said he had refused to tell them what he had said to PC Rowland at the gates of Downing Street. It wasn’t true. We had what purported to be PC Rowlands log of the incident at Downing Street, which talked of members of the public being “visibly shocked” by the altercation. Even though on the video there are no “shocked” members of the public to be seen, and his own colleagues who were present claim not to have heard a word of the alleged abuse.

In fact there is only one person, throughout the course of this whole affair, whose statements about what happened that evening have not been contradicted by any of the independent evidence. And that is Andrew Mitchell himself.'

Source:The Telgraph
PreviousNext

Who is online

Users browsing this forum: No registered users and 112 guests

REPLY

Subject: 
Message:
   
Please note using apple style emoji's can result in posting failures.
Use the FULL EDITOR to better format content or upload images, be notified of replies etc...

Return to The Sin Bin


RLFANS Recent Posts
FORUM
LAST
POST
TOPIC
POSTER
POSTS
5m
How many games will we win
PopTart
23
6m
Shopping list for 2025
DSJ1983
5581
43m
Planning for next season
Jack Gaskell
180
Recent
Game - Song Titles
Wanderer
40740
Recent
BORED The Band Name Game
Wanderer
63233
Recent
Film game
Wanderer
5664
Recent
New Players
Deadcowboys1
144
FORUM
LAST
VIEW
TOPIC
POSTER
POSTS
55s
Fixtures 2025
Jake the Peg
69
1m
Salford
Uncle Rico
18
1m
Ground Improvements
Trojan Horse
159
2m
Accounts
Greg Florimo
135
3m
Film game
Wanderer
5664
3m
War of the Roses
sally cinnam
35
3m
Other Championship Clubs
FIL
418
3m
2025 Shirt
apollosghost
18
4m
Leeds away first up
Big lads mat
49
5m
2025 Recruitment
dddooommm
199
FORUM
NEW
TOPICS
TOPIC
POSTER
POSTS
TODAY
Mike Ogunwole
Wanderer
1
TODAY
Bailey Dawson
Wanderer
1
TODAY
2024
poplar cats
12
TODAY
Dan Norman Retires
Cokey
1
TODAY
How many games will we win
PopTart
23
TODAY
Leigh Leopards - 2025 Fixtures
Cokey
5
TODAY
Catalan Away
Dannyboywt1
6
TODAY
2025 Betfred Super League Fixtures
RLFANS News
1
TODAY
2025 fixtures
Smiffy27
15
TODAY
Fixtures
Willzay
13
TODAY
Salford
Uncle Rico
18
TODAY
WCC Off
Choc Ice
11
TODAY
Leeds away first up
Big lads mat
49
TODAY
Jake McLoughlin
Wanderer
1
TODAY
Assistant Coach - Langley
exiledrhino
30
TODAY
Noah Booth out on loan
Big lads mat
22
TODAY
Luke Gale testimonial match
BarnsleyGull
2
NEWS ITEMS
VIEWS
2025 Betfred Super League Fixt..
907
Magic Weekend 2025 - Back To N..
571
England Beat Samoa To Take Tes..
1303
England's Women Demolish The W..
1137
England Beat Samoa Comfortably..
1370
Operational Rules Tribunal –..
1160
IMG-RFL club gradings released..
1420
Wakefield Trinity Win Champion..
1963
Hunslet Secure Promotion After..
2171
Trinity Into Play Off Final Af..
2413
Wigan Warriors Crowned Champio..
1982
York Valkyrie Win Back to Back..
2220
Hunslet Book Relegation Play O..
2687
Penrith Panthers Secure Fourth..
2115
Wigan Humiliate Leigh For Gran..
2184
RLFANS Match Centre
Matches on TV
Thu 13th Feb
SL
20:00
Wigan-Leigh
Fri 14th Feb
SL
20:00
Hull KR-Castleford
SL
20:00
Catalans-Hull FC
Sat 15th Feb
SL
15:00
Leeds - Wakefield
SL
17:30
St.Helens-Salford
Sun 16th Feb
SL
15:00
Huddersfield-Warrington
Thu 20th Feb
SL
20:00
Wakefield - Hull KR
Fri 21st Feb
SL
20:00
Warrington-Catalans
SL
20:00
Hull FC-Wigan
Sat 22nd Feb
SL
15:00
Salford-Leeds
SL
20:00
Castleford-St.Helens
Sun 23rd Feb
SL
14:30
Leigh-Huddersfield
Thu 6th Mar
SL
20:00
Hull FC-Leigh
Fri 7th Mar
SL
20:00
Castleford-Salford
SL
20:00
St.Helens-Hull KR
Sat 8th Mar
SL
17:30
Catalans-Leeds
Sun 9th Mar
SL
17:30
Warrington - Wakefield
SL
17:30
Wigan-Huddersfield
Thu 20th Mar
SL
20:00
Salford-Huddersfield
Fri 21st Mar
SL
20:00
St.Helens-Warrington
This is an inplay table and live positions can change.
Mens Betfred Super League XXVIII ROUND : 1
 PLDFADIFFPTS
Wigan 29 768 338 430 48
Hull KR 29 731 344 387 44
Warrington 29 769 351 418 42
Leigh 29 580 442 138 33
Salford 28 556 561 -5 32
St.Helens 28 618 411 207 30
 
Catalans 27 475 427 48 30
Leeds 27 530 488 42 28
Huddersfield 27 468 658 -190 20
Castleford 27 425 735 -310 15
Hull FC 27 328 894 -566 6
LondonB 27 317 916 -599 6
This is an inplay table and live positions can change.
Betfred Championship 2024 ROUND : 1
 PLDFADIFFPTS
Wakefield 27 1032 275 757 52
Toulouse 26 765 388 377 37
Bradford 28 723 420 303 36
York 29 695 501 194 32
Widnes 27 561 502 59 29
Featherstone 27 634 525 109 28
 
Sheffield 26 626 526 100 28
Doncaster 26 498 619 -121 25
Halifax 26 509 650 -141 22
Batley 26 422 591 -169 22
Swinton 28 484 676 -192 20
Barrow 25 442 720 -278 19
Whitehaven 25 437 826 -389 18
Dewsbury 27 348 879 -531 4
Hunslet 1 6 10 -4 0
RLFANS Recent Posts
FORUM
LAST
POST
TOPIC
POSTER
POSTS
5m
How many games will we win
PopTart
23
6m
Shopping list for 2025
DSJ1983
5581
43m
Planning for next season
Jack Gaskell
180
Recent
Game - Song Titles
Wanderer
40740
Recent
BORED The Band Name Game
Wanderer
63233
Recent
Film game
Wanderer
5664
Recent
New Players
Deadcowboys1
144
FORUM
LAST
VIEW
TOPIC
POSTER
POSTS
55s
Fixtures 2025
Jake the Peg
69
1m
Salford
Uncle Rico
18
1m
Ground Improvements
Trojan Horse
159
2m
Accounts
Greg Florimo
135
3m
Film game
Wanderer
5664
3m
War of the Roses
sally cinnam
35
3m
Other Championship Clubs
FIL
418
3m
2025 Shirt
apollosghost
18
4m
Leeds away first up
Big lads mat
49
5m
2025 Recruitment
dddooommm
199
FORUM
NEW
TOPICS
TOPIC
POSTER
POSTS
TODAY
Mike Ogunwole
Wanderer
1
TODAY
Bailey Dawson
Wanderer
1
TODAY
2024
poplar cats
12
TODAY
Dan Norman Retires
Cokey
1
TODAY
How many games will we win
PopTart
23
TODAY
Leigh Leopards - 2025 Fixtures
Cokey
5
TODAY
Catalan Away
Dannyboywt1
6
TODAY
2025 Betfred Super League Fixtures
RLFANS News
1
TODAY
2025 fixtures
Smiffy27
15
TODAY
Fixtures
Willzay
13
TODAY
Salford
Uncle Rico
18
TODAY
WCC Off
Choc Ice
11
TODAY
Leeds away first up
Big lads mat
49
TODAY
Jake McLoughlin
Wanderer
1
TODAY
Assistant Coach - Langley
exiledrhino
30
TODAY
Noah Booth out on loan
Big lads mat
22
TODAY
Luke Gale testimonial match
BarnsleyGull
2
NEWS ITEMS
VIEWS
2025 Betfred Super League Fixt..
907
Magic Weekend 2025 - Back To N..
571
England Beat Samoa To Take Tes..
1303
England's Women Demolish The W..
1137
England Beat Samoa Comfortably..
1370
Operational Rules Tribunal –..
1160
IMG-RFL club gradings released..
1420
Wakefield Trinity Win Champion..
1963
Hunslet Secure Promotion After..
2171
Trinity Into Play Off Final Af..
2413
Wigan Warriors Crowned Champio..
1982
York Valkyrie Win Back to Back..
2220
Hunslet Book Relegation Play O..
2687
Penrith Panthers Secure Fourth..
2115
Wigan Humiliate Leigh For Gran..
2184


Visit the RLFANS.COM SHOP
for more merchandise!