Re: Brexit Anyone ? (part 3) : Tue Dec 11, 2018 8:17 am  

Probably the one thing in this complete shambles that everybody agrees on is that May is absolutely useless. Having said that I am surprised that people on the remain camp have rejected her deal. Mainly because it seems to keep us in the EU . As for the Irish border issues, the Irish are playing a dangerous game. If we leave without a deal Eire will suffer. Over half of Irish beef is exported to the uk. That will be subject to a heavy tariff under wto rules. Also a large section of Irish exports are trucked across England and then onto Europe through the channel ports, any delays will hit them hard.

[Bullseye]

Re: Brexit Anyone ? (part 3) : Tue Dec 11, 2018 9:29 am  

Every chance they've had to kick the can down the road they've taken. Never underestimate their desire to hang onto power.

Re: Brexit Anyone ? (part 3) : Tue Dec 11, 2018 10:24 am  

Cronus wrote:

But saying that I'll never back down on Abbott. The idea she could end up in government is truly terrifying.

I can never understand what it is about Diane Abbott that gets people like you so exercised - particularly when you support a party that includes such dullards as Nadine Dorries, Boris Johnson, Gavin Williamson, Dominic Raab and Michael Gove; all either incompetent, opportunist or just thick as mince, but they never seem to be vilified in quite the same way as Abbott.

I wonder why...?

On the wider issue - spinning this delay as a bit of statecraft from Mrs May is quite the reach; pulling the vote because you know you're going to lose is somehow ok, whereas voting again on a matter that now has much more detail and clarity, is a betrayal of democracy?

As for the Labour position - it seems quite clear to me; they can't reverse Brexit for obvious reasons, so they're looking at the wider issues of dealing with poverty, homelessness, NHS and schools, and that requires them to be in power - hence the push for a GE; and to criticise the opposition for wanting to be in power is perverse - that's the whole point isn't it?

[Bullseye]

Re: Brexit Anyone ? (part 3) : Tue Dec 11, 2018 10:39 am  

bren2k wrote:

I can never understand what it is about Diane Abbott that gets people like you so exercised - particularly when you support a party that includes such dullards as Nadine Dorries, Boris Johnson, Gavin Williamson, Dominic Raab and Michael Gove; all either incompetent, opportunist or just thick as mince, but they never seem to be vilified in quite the same way as Abbott.

I wonder why...?

Re: Brexit Anyone ? (part 3) : Tue Dec 11, 2018 11:12 am  

bren2k wrote:

I can never understand what it is about Diane Abbott that gets people like you so exercised - particularly when you support a party that includes such dullards as Nadine Dorries, Boris Johnson, Gavin Williamson, Dominic Raab and Michael Gove; all either incompetent, opportunist or just thick as mince, but they never seem to be vilified in quite the same way as Abbott.

I wonder why...?

On the wider issue - spinning this delay as a bit of statecraft from Mrs May is quite the reach; pulling the vote because you know you're going to lose is somehow ok, whereas voting again on a matter that now has much more detail and clarity, is a betrayal of democracy?

As for the Labour position - it seems quite clear to me; they can't reverse Brexit for obvious reasons, so they're looking at the wider issues of dealing with poverty, homelessness, NHS and schools, and that requires them to be in power - hence the push for a GE; and to criticise the opposition for wanting to be in power is perverse - that's the whole point isn't it?

All of the above Tory politicians can actually add up some Mrs Abbot was incapable of doing when questioned on the Police cuts - nothing to do with her colour which is what you are alluding towards. Don't see the same finger pointing towards the likes of Chuka or Lamy - the latter is the most odious MP in the house his arrogance towards the whole Brexit has to seen to be believed right from the vote he has been suggests the politicians decide not the electorate

Re: Brexit Anyone ? (part 3) : Tue Dec 11, 2018 11:43 am  

Sal Paradise wrote:

All of the above Tory politicians can actually add up some Mrs Abbot was incapable of doing when questioned on the Police cuts - nothing to do with her colour which is what you are alluding towards. Don't see the same finger pointing towards the likes of Chuka or Lamy - the latter is the most odious MP in the house his arrogance towards the whole Brexit has to seen to be believed right from the vote he has been suggests the politicians decide not the electorate

There you go again - passing off the bumbling incompetence of *certain* types of politicians, but taking issue with Diane Abbott, because she misspoke some numbers on a live TV interview after an all nighter during the GE.

How about:

Dominic Raab, saying that he hadn't realised how important the Dover-Calais crossing was for trade?
David Davis, saying that a trade deal with the EU would be the easiest in history?
JRM - saying in the HoP that the best response to a close result would a 2nd referendum, then denying it?
Jeremy Hunt - the most hated health secretary in history, accidentally forgetting to declare that he made a fortune from buying houses off a Tory donor?
Boris Johnson - garden bridge, water cannons, arranging to have a journo beaten up, various racist things, etc etc ad infinitum?
Theresa May - there will be no GE; the meaningful vote will go ahead?

The list goes on - but it remains the case that Diane Abbott receives more abuse and targeted attacks than any other MP in the HoC, but it's somehow ok; I wonder why?

Re: Brexit Anyone ? (part 3) : Tue Dec 11, 2018 12:10 pm  

Sal Paradise wrote:

All of the above Tory politicians can actually add

Dominic Raab might be able to add up, but his recent admission about the importance of Calais/Dover was astonishing. Does he not know we are an island?

Re: Brexit Anyone ? (part 3) : Tue Dec 11, 2018 12:19 pm  

bren2k wrote:

There you go again - passing off the bumbling incompetence of *certain* types of politicians, but taking issue with Diane Abbott, because she misspoke some numbers on a live TV interview after an all nighter during the GE.

How about:

Dominic Raab, saying that he hadn't realised how important the Dover-Calais crossing was for trade?
David Davis, saying that a trade deal with the EU would be the easiest in history?
JRM - saying in the HoP that the best response to a close result would a 2nd referendum, then denying it?
Jeremy Hunt - the most hated health secretary in history, accidentally forgetting to declare that he made a fortune from buying houses off a Tory donor?
Boris Johnson - garden bridge, water cannons, arranging to have a journo beaten up, various racist things, etc etc ad infinitum?
Theresa May - there will be no GE; the meaningful vote will go ahead?

The list goes on - but it remains the case that Diane Abbott receives more abuse and targeted attacks than any other MP in the HoC, but it's somehow ok; I wonder why?

Diane Abbot has been made to look foolish on numerous occasions. The main one being on sky tv answering questions on a London police report. She obviously hadn’t read the report but tried to bluff her way through which proved to be a disaster . Probably the reason she receives a lot of abuse is whenever she publicly fails she always plays the race card. Likewise with lammy. Before anybody accuses me of bias I think the Tory party also has its share of incompetents. Politics is one of the few professions in which you don’t have to have any qualifications . A classic case being the clown who yesterday grabbed the mace. Never had a job in his life yet sits in parliament. As our American cousins would say go figure.

Re: Brexit Anyone ? (part 3) : Tue Dec 11, 2018 1:48 pm  

bren2k wrote:

There you go again - passing off the bumbling incompetence of *certain* types of politicians, but taking issue with Diane Abbott, because she misspoke some numbers on a live TV interview after an all nighter during the GE.

How about:

Dominic Raab, saying that he hadn't realised how important the Dover-Calais crossing was for trade?
David Davis, saying that a trade deal with the EU would be the easiest in history?
JRM - saying in the HoP that the best response to a close result would a 2nd referendum, then denying it?
Jeremy Hunt - the most hated health secretary in history, accidentally forgetting to declare that he made a fortune from buying houses off a Tory donor?
Boris Johnson - garden bridge, water cannons, arranging to have a journo beaten up, various racist things, etc etc ad infinitum?
Theresa May - there will be no GE; the meaningful vote will go ahead?

The list goes on - but it remains the case that Diane Abbott receives more abuse and targeted attacks than any other MP in the HoC, but it's somehow ok; I wonder why?

You can add to that 'no deal is better than a bad deal', mind you, I think that this covers 95% of Tory politicians and it's looking more and more like 'no deal' where we will end up.

Just on Abbott, it isn't just one comment on an election all nighter and whilst her constituants certainly keep on voting her back in, she's doing very well to remain in the shadow cabinet and one suspects that this is due to her loyalty to Mr Corbyn.

Re: Brexit Anyone ? (part 3) : Tue Dec 11, 2018 1:52 pm  

Backwoodsman wrote:

Probably the reason she receives a lot of abuse is whenever she publicly fails she always plays the race card. Likewise with lammy.

Wow - those uppity black folks - they should learn to just take it on the chin, right?