Re: Brexit Anyone ? (part 3) : Fri Jan 18, 2019 4:09 pm  

Sal Paradise wrote:

Canada/Mexico and the US

Do the US have a free trade deal with the EU ?

Re: Brexit Anyone ? (part 3) : Sat Jan 19, 2019 10:40 am  

wrencat1873 wrote:

Do the US have a free trade deal with the EU ?

How long have the EU been trying to get TTIP across the line - perhaps a smaller more agile country could achieve the same deal in less time?

[Mild Rover]

Re: Brexit Anyone ? (part 3) : Sat Jan 19, 2019 6:38 pm  

Sal Paradise wrote: How long have the EU been trying to get TTIP across the line - perhaps a smaller more agile country could achieve the same deal in less time? From beginning to end or before, given the EU’s head start? A genuine worry is that someone like Johnson or Raab might rush through botched deals to show some benefits of having done whatever we end up doing. This might have been put on the thread earlier, I guess - but I quite liked it: https://www.dezeen.com/2018/11/15/brexi ... n-pottery/

Sal Paradise wrote: How long have the EU been trying to get TTIP across the line - perhaps a smaller more agile country could achieve the same deal in less time? From beginning to end or before, given the EU’s head start? A genuine worry is that someone like Johnson or Raab might rush through botched deals to show some benefits of having done whatever we end up doing. This might have been put on the thread earlier, I guess - but I quite liked it: https://www.dezeen.com/2018/11/15/brexi ... n-pottery/

Re: Brexit Anyone ? (part 3) : Sat Jan 19, 2019 11:39 pm  

Mild Rover wrote: From beginning to end or before, given the EU’s head start? A genuine worry is that someone like Johnson or Raab might rush through botched deals to show some benefits of having done whatever we end up doing. This might have been put on the thread earlier, I guess - but I quite liked it: https://www.dezeen.com/2018/11/15/brexi ... n-pottery/ According to Boris and Farage, these deals are straight forward and can be sorted in no time at all With Mrs May seemingly still determined to get "her" deal (plus a few tweaks) through Parliament, we could well end up with "no deal" and be on WTO terms for a little while. There will be an extension to Article 50 and we could yet have a General Election and the only thing "saving us" is that The EU dont want a "no deal" outcome and maybe, just maybe there will be some concessions offered / given ???

Mild Rover wrote: From beginning to end or before, given the EU’s head start? A genuine worry is that someone like Johnson or Raab might rush through botched deals to show some benefits of having done whatever we end up doing. This might have been put on the thread earlier, I guess - but I quite liked it: https://www.dezeen.com/2018/11/15/brexi ... n-pottery/ According to Boris and Farage, these deals are straight forward and can be sorted in no time at all With Mrs May seemingly still determined to get "her" deal (plus a few tweaks) through Parliament, we could well end up with "no deal" and be on WTO terms for a little while. There will be an extension to Article 50 and we could yet have a General Election and the only thing "saving us" is that The EU dont want a "no deal" outcome and maybe, just maybe there will be some concessions offered / given ???

[Mild Rover]

Re: Brexit Anyone ? (part 3) : Sun Jan 20, 2019 1:53 pm  

wrencat1873 wrote:

the only thing "saving us" is that The EU dont want a "no deal" outcome and maybe, just maybe there will be some concessions offered / given ???

They’re strongly incentivised not to, imo. It’d encourage those think we just need to speak loudly and slowly to the idiot foreigners to secure a better deal.

They gave Dave something bring home and sell. They gave Theresa something to bring home and sell. I think they might now welcome to the opportunity to tell us to get stuffed for a change. If it turns really shizzle, it at least demonstrates the value of the EU, so there’d be that consolation for its continental advocates.

Re: Brexit Anyone ? (part 3) : Sun Jan 20, 2019 3:13 pm  

Mild Rover wrote:

They’re strongly incentivised not to, imo. It’d encourage those think we just need to speak loudly and slowly to the idiot foreigners to secure a better deal.

They gave Dave something bring home and sell. They gave Theresa something to bring home and sell. I think they might now welcome to the opportunity to tell us to get stuffed for a change. If it turns really shizzle, it at least demonstrates the value of the EU, so there’d be that consolation for its continental advocates.

Much as I dislike most things Troy, I'm not sure how much they gave either Cameron or May to work with, it was not in their interests to do so.

The one absolute certainty is that, they (the EU), were never going to make it "easy" for us (or anyone else) to leave and why should they ?

Re: Brexit Anyone ? (part 3) : Sun Jan 20, 2019 6:13 pm  

If I were May I would simply threaten a GE if the Tory MPs don't come to there senses. A number will lose their seats especially if May is the Tory leader going into the GE.

[Mild Rover]

Re: Brexit Anyone ? (part 3) : Sun Jan 20, 2019 8:53 pm  

wrencat1873 wrote:

Much as I dislike most things Troy, I'm not sure how much they gave either Cameron or May to work with, it was not in their interests to do so.

The one absolute certainty is that, they (the EU), were never going to make it "easy" for us (or anyone else) to leave and why should they ?

I agree. The special status that Cameron wanted was always going to have to be superficial - or everybody would be crying out for their own version. And he was asking for extra on top of the UK rebate. May’s red lines meant they couldn’t give us much of the good stuff or there’d be a rush for the exit. It has more been a case of them explaining the consequences of her decisions and sorting out the technical details than a back and forth negotiation - that’s the impression I get, anyway.

I suspect a lot of the rebel Tories will be willing to give way on the Irish border backstop, whether enough will... At some point May will have to unequivocally say what the real alternative to voting for her deal is. Technically it is no deal, but there’s still a sense that ad we approach the cliff edge, she would hit the brakes. Sometimes it is a diminishing sense, but if the preparations look half-baked I think the voices of concern will get ever louder.

Labour need some tories to save them from having to save May from some other tories. It’s a multilevel game of chicken.

Re: Brexit Anyone ? (part 3) : Sun Jan 20, 2019 10:10 pm  

One thing that everyone must agree with is that the shower that we vote for in the commons what ever the party are a total waste of space, They never seem to learn. Their credibility was shot to bits during the recent expenses scandal, even more recently the SNP swept the board in Scotland yet, in the referendum they voted to stay in the UK, they just cannot see that people are totally fed up with all of the main parties. They now have an opportunity to make good on a democratic vote of the people and they cannot and won't deliver. If we need money for the NHS and more housing get rid of that jobs for the boys lot in the House of Lords. I am traditionally a Labour voter, but cannot vote for "everything is still on the table Labour". Who the hell do I vote for.

Re: Brexit Anyone ? (part 3) : Sun Jan 20, 2019 11:47 pm  

Sal Paradise wrote:

If I were May I would simply threaten a GE if the Tory MPs don't come to there senses. A number will lose their seats especially if May is the Tory leader going into the GE.

Even that wont work.

Had Brexit been a party issue, the thing would have been sorted long ago but, it's not.
Both of the main parties are badly split on the issue and with so many of our MP being in favour of remain, despite their constituants having voted " leave", they either run with their conscience or, follow the will of the voting public and far too many wish to follow their conscience.
Add to that "the deal that pleases no one nad you reach the current stalemate.