Re: A Contemporary Christmas Carol : Sat Dec 28, 2013 4:23 pm  

Mintball wrote:

And its leader stated: "There will be no more top-down reorganisations of the NHS".

Indeed, so if you had voted for that party in 2010 then you would truly be under the impression that there was to be no selling off of the NHS to private operators at all and that the organisation would be safe in that party's hands.

I do recall another party promising the abolition of student university tuition fees too, can't remember what happened to that party though.

Re: A Contemporary Christmas Carol : Sun Dec 29, 2013 9:04 am  

This http://www.theguardian.com/commentisfree/2013/nov/02/iain-duncan-smith-tories-useful-idiot pretty much sums up IDS for me, along with Gove he is the patsy, the fall guy for the governing party, defending what is sometimes indefensible with what are sometimes outright lies, taking the flak for what were always going to be distasteful economic policies, they are not experts in their office and neither do they need to be, their job is simply to keep David Cameron and George Osborne in a job and untouched by criticism and in that they are doing a damn fine job, the last couple of paragraphs in that article say everything you need to know.

This http://www.theguardian.com/commentisfree/2013/nov/02/iain-duncan-smith-tories-useful-idiot pretty much sums up IDS for me, along with Gove he is the patsy, the fall guy for the governing party, defending what is sometimes indefensible with what are sometimes outright lies, taking the flak for what were always going to be distasteful economic policies, they are not experts in their office and neither do they need to be, their job is simply to keep David Cameron and George Osborne in a job and untouched by criticism and in that they are doing a damn fine job, the last couple of paragraphs in that article say everything you need to know.

Re: A Contemporary Christmas Carol : Sun Dec 29, 2013 9:22 am  

JerryChicken wrote:

Indeed, one of the "major parties" spent a lot of money on a huge poster campaign promising to cut the deficit and not the NHS.

they proved they didn't know what they were doing when they announced the removal of the Harrier from the Navy and Air Force as well as are only aircraft carrier as a way of saving money.

Re: A Contemporary Christmas Carol : Sun Dec 29, 2013 9:38 am  

JerryChicken wrote: This http://www.theguardian.com/commentisfree/2013/nov/02/iain-duncan-smith-tories-useful-idiot pretty much sums up IDS for me, along with Gove he is the patsy, the fall guy for the governing party, defending what is sometimes indefensible with what are sometimes outright lies, taking the flak for what were always going to be distasteful economic policies, they are not experts in their office and neither do they need to be, their job is simply to keep David Cameron and George Osborne in a job and untouched by criticism and in that they are doing a damn fine job, the last couple of paragraphs in that article say everything you need to know. Newsnight exposed him some 11 years ago about his lying about his qualifications on his CV and his employment. It just proves that leopards really do not change their spots.

JerryChicken wrote: This http://www.theguardian.com/commentisfree/2013/nov/02/iain-duncan-smith-tories-useful-idiot pretty much sums up IDS for me, along with Gove he is the patsy, the fall guy for the governing party, defending what is sometimes indefensible with what are sometimes outright lies, taking the flak for what were always going to be distasteful economic policies, they are not experts in their office and neither do they need to be, their job is simply to keep David Cameron and George Osborne in a job and untouched by criticism and in that they are doing a damn fine job, the last couple of paragraphs in that article say everything you need to know. Newsnight exposed him some 11 years ago about his lying about his qualifications on his CV and his employment. It just proves that leopards really do not change their spots.

Re: A Contemporary Christmas Carol : Sun Dec 29, 2013 9:58 am  

Hull White Star wrote:

Newsnight exposed him some 11 years ago about his lying about his qualifications on his CV and his employment. It just proves that leopards really do not change their spots.

It does seem to be quite endemic in the tory party

Re: A Contemporary Christmas Carol : Sun Dec 29, 2013 11:54 am  

World of Redboy wrote: they proved they didn't know what they were doing when they announced the removal of the Harrier from the Navy and Air Force as well as are only aircraft carrier as a way of saving money. You know, I was going to make some remark about the planned replacement aircraft carriers and not havign any aircraft to place on them and so searched for an up to date story on their construction... ...and found this http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-24833555 Very interesting and informative until you reach the very last couple of paragraphs and this one in particular... According to reports, the latest price increase to £6.2bn is mainly down to failing to factor in the costs of inflation and VAT into the original contract. And thats where you stop, and read it again, and sit and stare at the screen open-mouthed as you wonder what sort of fookwits we have in charge of our civil service when they "failed to factor in inflation AND VAT". Failed to include VAT ? WTF ?????????

World of Redboy wrote: they proved they didn't know what they were doing when they announced the removal of the Harrier from the Navy and Air Force as well as are only aircraft carrier as a way of saving money. You know, I was going to make some remark about the planned replacement aircraft carriers and not havign any aircraft to place on them and so searched for an up to date story on their construction... ...and found this http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-24833555 Very interesting and informative until you reach the very last couple of paragraphs and this one in particular... According to reports, the latest price increase to £6.2bn is mainly down to failing to factor in the costs of inflation and VAT into the original contract. And thats where you stop, and read it again, and sit and stare at the screen open-mouthed as you wonder what sort of fookwits we have in charge of our civil service when they "failed to factor in inflation AND VAT". Failed to include VAT ? WTF ?????????

Re: A Contemporary Christmas Carol : Sun Dec 29, 2013 12:58 pm  

Hull White Star wrote: All I can do is laugh at you You really have no idea at all. I know you haven't been around here for long (or have you?) but I shouldn't have to prove to them or you that I have had hip replacements, knee replacements, foot fusions, joint damage, etc etc, a letter from the top professor in the country (at Chapel Allerton in Leeds), my GP, physio, occupational health, podiatrists and radiographers, should be enough. Come back to me when you know what you are talking about, that goes for the ESA50 form you "have in front of you". I see you don't mention about picking up an empty cardboard box, nor lifting one arm to put something in your top pocket questions. I suspect you are a troll and a very bad one at that. Sorry, for the delay. Xmas and all that going on, so, what have I missed? Actually, you should have to prove you've had the procedures you claim, otherwise there'd be people claiming they'd had all sorts done and the authorities just accepting it as read. Lo and behold you do provide evidence from various medical experts. Why would I bring up the picking up of a box or the top pocket thing? You never asked me about those. So, what exactly is the problem with the question? Can you pick up and move a large, light object like an empty cardboard box? No Yes It varies Use this space to tell us more about picking things up and moving them. Tell us why you might not be able to pick things up. If it varies tell us how. In fact, here's the form. https://www.gov.uk/government/uploads/s ... esa-50.pdf This is your post from earlier in the thread. How much pain did you say you were in on your ESA50 pre 2008 in the half a page box asking you to explain and which box did you tick to say if you could hold a pen in your ESA50 post 2010. Go and have a look at 5. Manual Dexterity (using your hands), there is indeed a "tick box", then right next to it, a lovely big box to explain further. Perhaps you've simply forgotten as you've got your money, no wonder you're laughing.

Hull White Star wrote: All I can do is laugh at you You really have no idea at all. I know you haven't been around here for long (or have you?) but I shouldn't have to prove to them or you that I have had hip replacements, knee replacements, foot fusions, joint damage, etc etc, a letter from the top professor in the country (at Chapel Allerton in Leeds), my GP, physio, occupational health, podiatrists and radiographers, should be enough. Come back to me when you know what you are talking about, that goes for the ESA50 form you "have in front of you". I see you don't mention about picking up an empty cardboard box, nor lifting one arm to put something in your top pocket questions. I suspect you are a troll and a very bad one at that. Sorry, for the delay. Xmas and all that going on, so, what have I missed? Actually, you should have to prove you've had the procedures you claim, otherwise there'd be people claiming they'd had all sorts done and the authorities just accepting it as read. Lo and behold you do provide evidence from various medical experts. Why would I bring up the picking up of a box or the top pocket thing? You never asked me about those. So, what exactly is the problem with the question? Can you pick up and move a large, light object like an empty cardboard box? No Yes It varies Use this space to tell us more about picking things up and moving them. Tell us why you might not be able to pick things up. If it varies tell us how. In fact, here's the form. https://www.gov.uk/government/uploads/s ... esa-50.pdf This is your post from earlier in the thread. How much pain did you say you were in on your ESA50 pre 2008 in the half a page box asking you to explain and which box did you tick to say if you could hold a pen in your ESA50 post 2010. Go and have a look at 5. Manual Dexterity (using your hands), there is indeed a "tick box", then right next to it, a lovely big box to explain further. Perhaps you've simply forgotten as you've got your money, no wonder you're laughing.

Re: A Contemporary Christmas Carol : Sun Dec 29, 2013 1:10 pm  

JerryChicken wrote:

My mother had her hairdresser round the house the day before she succumbed to her cancer because she fully intended to be going out that weekend, however you miss the point entirely - we, the taxpayer, paid handsomely for a private company to assess everyone on any sort of disability benefit in order to sort out the hundreds of thousands of shirkers that we had been promised were hiding behind fake illnesses, what they did in order to generate the numbers to justify the propaganda was tick the "fit to work" boxes for people with diagnosed terminal illnesses who then went on to prove their diagnosis correct by dying.

I'm not missing any point, but you carry on patronising. Do I qualify as being unable to work as my condition, being alive, is terminal? Should we just make a law that companies aren't allowed to employ people with cancer in case they do die? What about non terminal HIV/Aids? MS? You know, just to be on the safe side?

Re: A Contemporary Christmas Carol : Sun Dec 29, 2013 1:38 pm  

Mintball wrote:

This is factually incorrect.

None of the major parties "promised ... NHS privatisation". Thus nobody voted for it.

From each manifesto, I won't say which, you can guess. And if you can spot the differences you win a shiny ha'penny.
1.

Foundation Trusts will be given the freedom to expand their provision into primary and community care, and to increase their private services

We will support an active role for the independent sector working alongside the NHS in the provision of care, particularly where they bring innovation – such as in end-of-life care and cancer services,and increase capacity.

2.

So we will give every patient the power to choose any healthcare provider that meets NHS standards, within NHS prices.This includes independent, voluntary and community sector providers.

3.

Giving Local Health Boards the freedom to commission services for local people from a range of different types of provider, including for example staff co-operatives, on the basis of a level playing field in any competitive tendering – ending any current bias in favour of private providers.

I like the last one best, very, very carefully mentioning staff co-ops, and in no way mentioning "independent" providers. Doesn't quite say private providers will be outlawed though. Just that they won't get the perceived favourable bias that they did under the Labour Party.

Manifestos are great reads, you have to really read every sentence, it's truly a testament to our population that each voter takes the time to read each one to make an informed decision.

Re: A Contemporary Christmas Carol : Sun Dec 29, 2013 2:04 pm  

BobbyD wrote: Sorry, for the delay. Xmas and all that going on, so, what have I missed? Actually, you should have to prove you've had the procedures you claim, otherwise there'd be people claiming they'd had all sorts done and the authorities just accepting it as read. Lo and behold you do provide evidence from various medical experts. Why would I bring up the picking up of a box or the top pocket thing? You never asked me about those. So, what exactly is the problem with the question? In fact, here's the form. https://www.gov.uk/government/uploads/s ... esa-50.pdf This is your post from earlier in the thread. Go and have a look at 5. Manual Dexterity (using your hands), there is indeed a "tick box", then right next to it, a lovely big box to explain further. Perhaps you've simply forgotten as you've got your money, no wonder you're laughing. You can fill in the "explain further" box all you like, unless you know what turn of phrases they are looking for they will just ignore anything you put in there. And yes, I have my money, until June, when I have to go through the farce all over again even when the evidence suggests that nothing at all will have changed. I have RA which there is no cure for and it is a disease that only gets worse. Bit like when they are calling amputees back, just in case they have grown their limb back within the year. Like I said, come back to me when you can comment about it due to experience and not what you *think* you know about it.

BobbyD wrote: Sorry, for the delay. Xmas and all that going on, so, what have I missed? Actually, you should have to prove you've had the procedures you claim, otherwise there'd be people claiming they'd had all sorts done and the authorities just accepting it as read. Lo and behold you do provide evidence from various medical experts. Why would I bring up the picking up of a box or the top pocket thing? You never asked me about those. So, what exactly is the problem with the question? In fact, here's the form. https://www.gov.uk/government/uploads/s ... esa-50.pdf This is your post from earlier in the thread. Go and have a look at 5. Manual Dexterity (using your hands), there is indeed a "tick box", then right next to it, a lovely big box to explain further. Perhaps you've simply forgotten as you've got your money, no wonder you're laughing. You can fill in the "explain further" box all you like, unless you know what turn of phrases they are looking for they will just ignore anything you put in there. And yes, I have my money, until June, when I have to go through the farce all over again even when the evidence suggests that nothing at all will have changed. I have RA which there is no cure for and it is a disease that only gets worse. Bit like when they are calling amputees back, just in case they have grown their limb back within the year. Like I said, come back to me when you can comment about it due to experience and not what you *think* you know about it.