Re: Cas game boxing day : Fri Dec 27, 2013 10:08 am  

Congratulations for posting a small summary, which reinforces what I've said.

"are to a degree" and "proposed". To a degree implies that not all of the application was based on a new stadium but we illustrated the projections that we felt we could achieve should the new stadium go ahead.

"Proposed" - A mooted idea put forward but by no means guaranteed.

As I said, the new stadium was always based on us self-funding it and not relying on handouts from councils. The economy crashed in 2007 (care to remember), which meant that the land was no longer sufficient enough for housing as it wouldn't provide enough cash for us.

There was a blast licence in place from Hicksons which had to be removed before any application could be made for Wheldon Rd and this took several years to remove from our council.

And then, when we arranged for a supermarket to buy the stadium, their focus changed meaning that they were no longer willing to commit to buying the land at a speed we needed.

There have been a lot of factors outside of our control with the new stadium but only the naïve would accept that this was the ONLY criteria determining licences in Super League. I understand to an extent your bitterness but take a look at your club 3/4 years ago and be honest - did it really have the infrastructure in place to overtake someone like Cas (if I remember rightly you didn't have an academy?). Never in my book.

In fact, why don't we look at the good of Cas - our youth production? Our limited reliance on overseas players in comparison to other clubs...oh, and the fact we haven't got into financial issues unlike Bradford, Wakefield, London and Salford..

Never mind. Apologies for the thread drift but this 'you lied'+'stadia misconception' really gets on my goat from people who haven't a foggiest.

Re: Cas game boxing day : Fri Dec 27, 2013 10:12 am  

halifaxjohn wrote:

Castleford Tigers - Grade C
Castleford Tigers provided a well presented and authored application, detailing realistic, intelligent and achievable strategies for future commercial and supporter growth. However the strategies and targets are to a degree based upon the move to a new facility in 2013. At present Castleford are a well-run, sustainable club that lives within its means and produces above average numbers of Super League quality players. Whilst hamstrung by an inadequate facility, and the restrictions on commercial revenues and supporter base this causes, the club makes a good contribution to the Super League. Significant growth of the business is reliant upon the club moving to the proposed new stadium to enable further investment in management, first team squad and player production. The significant challenge for the club in the next Licence period will be to move to the proposed new facility.


No further comment necessary.

No further comment necessary.

Re: Cas game boxing day : Fri Dec 27, 2013 10:26 am  

Fully wrote:

Barring 5/6 of those (the majority of which went off after 20 mins and were replaced with youngsters) a lot of those are back up players. Clare and Channing are hardly experienced SL professionals and Gilmour has just come back from several months out. Owen will be 3rd choice winger behind Dixon and Carney.

Again, I wasn't saying it was YOUR fault nor have I ever suggested that. The team that started the game was 18-6 until changes occurred - then it all went Pete Tong.

I came on here in peace to discuss rugby, not looking for disgraceful insults. That is extremely sad from Fax fans I've always held in high esteem.

Unfortunatley some of our fans have obsessions about other teams stadiums and the number of fans they have.

My point was that the team you put out contained a lot of players who will play a lot of games for you this season and was really just checking if that was the case as a couple of Cas fans I talked to only thought there were about 4 or 5 players to come in to the line up from yesterday. Players like Dorn and Channing I would expect to be playing a lot of games unlike the other Cas poster who seems to think they wont. I know you had eight players on the bench but we also made the same amount of changes and also a lot of players that came off did come back in to the game in the 2nd half so to make out we were just playing youngsters for the majority of the game was perhaps a bit misleading.

At times you could see the difference in quality as Cas showed their SL class to finsih chances one very similar to the one we bombed that would have won the game in the 2nd half although I would say that the Cas player who put him in to touch was so late that it was a clear penalty but hey ho. Anyway I thought it was an entertaining game that probably benefited us more than Cas but a draw was probably a fair result.

Re: Cas game boxing day : Fri Dec 27, 2013 10:30 am  

So both teams had some good young prospects on show!

Both teams seemed to give it all on their 1st run out of the year!

Both teams have players to come into the starting 17 plus probably still new faves to be added to the squads.

It was a good game that could have gone either way, right to the death.

I left full of confidence that the new players KH has added to especially the ball playing positions I out team will go into to course more than a few problems for our opponents.

We've got a star in Ben Johnston, he was head and shoulders above anything that Cas had in the halves yesterday. Maybe the Cas fans should be asking why young players like him have been replaced by ageing ones like Dorn/Finn?!

All in all KH will be a lot happier than DP and I'm sure us Fax fans a lot happier than the Cas!

We have a good shot next year of seeing silverware and have a miles better facility then the one we visited yesterday! Rather than trying to patronise and saying that Cas had a second team out I would be looking at Cas as a whole!

Anyway I'm looking forward to the new season!

Hopefully Cas fans can say the same!?!

Re: Cas game boxing day : Fri Dec 27, 2013 10:32 am  

Fully wrote:

Congratulations for posting a small summary, which reinforces what I've said.

"are to a degree" and "proposed". To a degree implies that not all of the application was based on a new stadium but we illustrated the projections that we felt we could achieve should the new stadium go ahead.

"Proposed" - A mooted idea put forward but by no means guaranteed.

As I said, the new stadium was always based on us self-funding it and not relying on handouts from councils. The economy crashed in 2007 (care to remember), which meant that the land was no longer sufficient enough for housing as it wouldn't provide enough cash for us.

There was a blast licence in place from Hicksons which had to be removed before any application could be made for Wheldon Rd and this took several years to remove from our council.

And then, when we arranged for a supermarket to buy the stadium, their focus changed meaning that they were no longer willing to commit to buying the land at a speed we needed.

There have been a lot of factors outside of our control with the new stadium but only the naïve would accept that this was the ONLY criteria determining licences in Super League. I understand to an extent your bitterness but take a look at your club 3/4 years ago and be honest - did it really have the infrastructure in place to overtake someone like Cas (if I remember rightly you didn't have an academy?). Never in my book.

In fact, why don't we look at the good of Cas - our youth production? Our limited reliance on overseas players in comparison to other clubs...oh, and the fact we haven't got into financial issues unlike Bradford, Wakefield, London and Salford..

Never mind. Apologies for the thread drift but this 'you lied'+'stadia misconception' really gets on my goat from people who haven't a foggiest.

Sorry but this is what the hated Licence system creates, our annoyance is with the system as it creates lies and deceit at worst and at best a manipulation of the facts by SL clubs while Championship clubs have to stick to the rules or else.
Fat Controller has total control so clubs like Cas say what he wants to hear and that ticks the box, regards Academies you may not know this but at our level there is no money to run one and I believe the RFL don't let clubs outside SL run one anyway as believe it or not we get rock all from the RFL (the Premier Sports TV deal is of no financial benefit) so this means it is an unfair comparison.
Anyway good luck for next season and hopefully we will be joining you in SL in the near future.

Re: Cas game boxing day : Fri Dec 27, 2013 10:52 am  

Fully. It was the original patronising tone of your first post I was reacting to. Sounded like a super league fan who arrogantly thought his club should smash a "minnow" and then dreaming up excuses.

Take some time to research the restraints the RFL have put on championship clubs before commenting. We have no academy cos we are not allowed to run one by the RFL. Our salary cap is less than 20% that of a super league and our overseas quota is one, but yet you still get knocked out of the challenge cup by championship clubs. Our tv deal involves us getting £0 and playing our highest profile games at silly o'clock on a Thursday evening, affecting what would be our biggest attendances. All the money we have to spend has to be generated by the club. If we want to apply for a licence, we have to cover licence criteria better than super league clubs - I give you Bradford, London, Salford, Crusaders, Wakefield.

The gap between bottom super league clubs and top championship clubs is so narrow, you would see it if you cared to look. In my opinion, Featherstone are a better club now than 5 or 6 clubs in super league, your own included. Sheffield have a cracking set up on such small gates. These clubs certainly deserve more respect than to be coerced into becoming "feeder" clubs to failing super league clubs. Thing is, championship clubs will never get into super league because of the restraints put on them by the very executive board that should be encouraging the growth, development and upward movement of ALL the clubs it represents. That is why fans of championship clubs are p****d off and gates are falling.

If you want to discuss this massive part of our game, go do some research, outside of super league, and we will be glad to discuss it. Bet you end up as frustrated and worried about the SPORT as we are.

Rant over

Re: Cas game boxing day : Fri Dec 27, 2013 12:41 pm  

freddies wig wrote:

Fully. It was the original patronising tone of your first post I was reacting to. Sounded like a super league fan who arrogantly thought his club should smash a "minnow" and then dreaming up excuses.

Take some time to research the restraints the RFL have put on championship clubs before commenting. We have no academy cos we are not allowed to run one by the RFL. Our salary cap is less than 20% that of a super league and our overseas quota is one, but yet you still get knocked out of the challenge cup by championship clubs. Our tv deal involves us getting £0 and playing our highest profile games at silly o'clock on a Thursday evening, affecting what would be our biggest attendances. All the money we have to spend has to be generated by the club. If we want to apply for a licence, we have to cover licence criteria better than super league clubs - I give you Bradford, London, Salford, Crusaders, Wakefield.

The gap between bottom super league clubs and top championship clubs is so narrow, you would see it if you cared to look. In my opinion, Featherstone are a better club now than 5 or 6 clubs in super league, your own included. Sheffield have a cracking set up on such small gates. Thing is, championship clubs will never get into super league because of the restraints put on them by the very executive board that should be encouraging the growth, development and upward movement of ALL the clubs it represents. That is why fans of championship clubs are p****d off and gates are falling.

If you want to discuss this massive part of our game, go do some research, outside of super league, and we will be glad to discuss it. Bet you end up as frustrated and worried about the SPORT as we are.

Rant over

Top post

Re: Cas game boxing day : Fri Dec 27, 2013 9:11 pm  

halifaxjohn wrote:

Blimey a quote without mentioning which pub your in and what strength beer your drinking, mind you as erudite as usual.
Not mentioned Mrs Hudd-Shay for a while!

Erudite? I don't know if that is a compliment or an insult, i will have to look it up. Lol. Any road, Richard Oastlar, Brighouse, Acorn Winter Pale Ale 4.5% Mmm! Mrs Hudd-Shay at home making turkey curry! Back to the Cas game we really enjoyed it but how on earth does that ground pass the dreaded H&S rules?

Re: Cas game boxing day : Fri Dec 27, 2013 10:23 pm  

Part quote.

"It was the original patronising tone of your first post I was reacting to. Sounded like a super league fan who arrogantly thought his club should smash a "minnow" and then dreaming up excuses."

Whether or not there was arrogance in the the post it gets much worse than that Freddie.

The last time I was on the Wigan forum debating the IL stance.

Namely.
"I want all the money for Super League and the Championship clubs should get nothing approach", to a man it was IL is right no matter what and screw everyone else.

One person referred to the Championship clubs including Halifax as "fleas on the dogs back" and such clubs bring nothing to the game so deserve nothing from it so how dare they dictate to the mighty Super League.

What chance have you got to reason with people who think like that.

Re: Cas game boxing day : Fri Dec 27, 2013 11:19 pm  

What IL is complaining about has nothing to do with Championship clubs. The massive problem in the game lies squarely with SL. In a nutshell - they can't afford full time rugby. Simple as that.