Re: For the live of God,Allah or whoever-McDermott GO!!! : Thu Oct 12, 2017 7:30 am  

Sal Paradise wrote:

I can only think of a couple of games where Leeds have played anywhere near the potential of the players they have in the squad. On defence the points conceded is very similar to 2016 so I am not sure the improved defence stands up to scrutiny. In Kallum Watkins you have one of the most outstanding athletes in the game yet he seldom get the opportunity to show his skills its a travesty.

On the final every try came via a kick - Leeds never looked like they had the skills or the set moves to break Cas down. Whilst Eden lost the ball at the last minute the move that led up that was a delight to see.

As I have said before you cannot knock McDermott's record it is second to none - do I really enjoy watching the style of rugby his teams play week in week out - not really its effective but its so dull.

A change of style would be great - maybe you can't have both?

We played the conditions in the final, that in itself is a joy to watch IMO we did have the skills to break Castleford down, they didn't have the skill to break us down. And you're right evens move was a delight to see, but not in the way you saw it it was a delight to see McGuire save the try from being scored.

Either our attack or defence improved from 2016 - the league position and GF winners rings show that. Our points difference at the end of regular season was -172 in 2016 in 2017 it was +76 and after the super 8s it was +126

Re: For the live of God,Allah or whoever-McDermott GO!!! : Thu Oct 12, 2017 8:10 am  

Listening to McDs post mactch press conference after the grand final, he talks about how after the cas loss in the third round Gary hetherington was on the phone all weekend saying things need to change and they need to start picking up results and how GH was having to settle the board of directors. (Remember he then gave 4 weeks for a turn around)

McD then said him and Mags had a very difficult conversation the Monday morning.

He said all those conversations were difficult to have and everyone probably got stuff wrong in those conversations. How ever ultimately the result of all those convos was to hold your nerve.

Imagine that pressure he must have been under at that stage. He was told he needed results, and he delivered. 2nd place in the league with only 1 less point than our treble winning season. And then bringing home the grand final as champions.

I truely belive this season was about answering questions and bring home results. Not about playing the most attractive rugby in the league.

I also find it almost laughable how quiet the Doom mongers have been this week.

Re: For the live of God,Allah or whoever-McDermott GO!!! : Thu Oct 12, 2017 9:55 am  

christopher wrote:

We played the conditions in the final, that in itself is a joy to watch IMO we did have the skills to break Castleford down, they didn't have the skill to break us down. And you're right evens move was a delight to see, but not in the way you saw it it was a delight to see McGuire save the try from being scored.

Either our attack or defence improved from 2016 - the league position and GF winners rings show that. Our points difference at the end of regular season was -172 in 2016 in 2017 it was +76 and after the super 8s it was +126

The performance from Leeds was as good as any final performance apart from 2007 - they stuck to their game plan and delivered. Most neutral commentators have suggest it was worst ever final quality wise, make of that what you will.

The defence improved slightly 100 points over 23 games so a marginal gain on a truly horrific previous year. You cannot compare the Super 8's to the qualifiers in 2016

On the Eden move - I go to games to see great athletes performing to their potential. I am not blinded to a quality move just because Leeds didn't perform it. Everyone is crying out for tries that don't come from kicks - the precision of that move was stunning to see live. If you watch the NRL you can see how much more they work on the precision of these moves and the game is a more attractive spectacle because of it

Re: For the live of God,Allah or whoever-McDermott GO!!! : Thu Oct 12, 2017 10:04 am  

Sal Paradise wrote:

Most neutral commentators have suggest it was worst ever final quality wise, make of that what you will.

I make of it that they were all expecting Cas to walk it and got proved wrong.

I agree with you that it was the best GF performance since 2007 - I actually think its my favourite GF win, not for the actual game but the story behind it all.

Yes that Eden no try move was great, McGuire last ditch effort to stop it was better IMHO.

[Ex-Swarcliffe Rhino]

Re: For the live of God,Allah or whoever-McDermott GO!!! : Thu Oct 12, 2017 10:05 am  

[quote="Joshheff90"]
I truely believe this season was about answering questions and bring home results. Not about playing the most attractive rugby in the league.[quote]

I'd go further in this and say that it was about proving that the squad that had been written off, laughed at and vilified was capable of taking out the trophies.

Re: For the live of God,Allah or whoever-McDermott GO!!! : Thu Oct 12, 2017 10:43 am  

Sal Paradise wrote:

The defence improved slightly 100 points over 23 games so a marginal gain on a truly horrific previous year. You cannot compare the Super 8's to the qualifiers in 2016

On the Eden move - I go to games to see great athletes performing to their potential. I am not blinded to a quality move just because Leeds didn't perform it. Everyone is crying out for tries that don't come from kicks - the precision of that move was stunning to see live. If you watch the NRL you can see how much more they work on the precision of these moves and the game is a more attractive spectacle because of it

With 2016 the defensive numbers got a real boost towards the end of the regular season when we managed to find a bit of form, get players back, Segeyaro in and back at Kirkstall and drag ourselves up to 9th. The last 7 games we averaged less than 15 points against us, the first 16 games it was almost 30, so maybe more appropriate to say the defence has improved massively from the first half of 2016 when it would crumble.

Wrt points against this season, again just sticking with the opening 23 rounds. Castleford were responsible for nearly a quarter of our points against so whilst we had the well documented Cas problem, against the rest of the league we didn't do too bad overall.

(Points against total 477.....points against vs Cas 118 = 24.7%)

Re: For the live of God,Allah or whoever-McDermott GO!!! : Thu Oct 12, 2017 11:10 am  

Iv never been the biggest fan of mcdermott,but even i cant argue with his results,he's as good a leader of a group of men as you will find anywhere. His strengths as a coach cant be tought imo,your either an inspirational leader or your not,he is by the bucketload and its served our club fantastically well.

The frustrating thing for me is that his weaknesses as a coach are a lot easier to find and can be compensated for with a good assistant coach,someone Who can put a few set plays and a bit of sructure together for when we get into the opposition 20. Our game is fine,obviously,we'r the champions,but for me our play in the opposition 20 is our biggest weakness. Very rarely do we see ryan hall just having to catch a ball and put it down because he's on the end of a set play thats created an overlap,more often than not he either has to muscle his way through a tackle or outjump someone to score. Im not suggesting reinventing the way we play, just having a few set plays and a bit of sructure to mix in with it.

This isnt an anti brian post or negative post (iv said in another thread that i think the clubs in a great situation now and moving forward) its Just something i see that could help us improve further,I think with the right addition to the backroom staff we could have the best of both worlds everything brian gives us and a little bit of what he dosnt. I honestly think we could take our game to an even higher level.

Re: For the live of God,Allah or whoever-McDermott GO!!! : Thu Oct 12, 2017 12:03 pm  

leedsnsouths wrote:

Genuine question, did you enjoy most of last season? (not just the last 2 weeks)

Yes, I enjoy every season but the latter part of 2017 where we had pretty much a full squad to choose from every week was the best part, strangely enough.

Re: For the live of God,Allah or whoever-McDermott GO!!! : Thu Oct 12, 2017 12:04 pm  

loiner81 wrote:

They'll be back soon enough, to spread their words of wisdom, unfortunately.

Oh dear, sooner that even I expected.

Sal Paradise wrote:

whine, moan, McDermott, realist, blah.....

Re: For the live of God,Allah or whoever-McDermott GO!!! : Thu Oct 12, 2017 12:15 pm  

PrinterThe wrote:

With 2016 the defensive numbers got a real boost towards the end of the regular season when we managed to find a bit of form, get players back, Segeyaro in and back at Kirkstall and drag ourselves up to 9th. The last 7 games we averaged less than 15 points against us, the first 16 games it was almost 30, so maybe more appropriate to say the defence has improved massively from the first half of 2016 when it would crumble.

Wrt points against this season, again just sticking with the opening 23 rounds. Castleford were responsible for nearly a quarter of our points against so whilst we had the well documented Cas problem, against the rest of the league we didn't do too bad overall.

(Points against total 477.....points against vs Cas 118 = 24.7%)

Leeds also played the some of the weaker teams towards the end of the season so you would expect an improvement IIRC.