Re: Gary Hetherington : Wed Jun 14, 2023 9:38 am  

Shabino wrote:

The Leeds version of KH is almost exactly the same as the Saints version (he actually looks bigger now), just better players around him.

I disagree, he's running much better lines, and as long as it's not with Richie Myler he is much more effective in the tackle.

I agree that having better players around him is helping that, but most of it is down to the application of the player and the fine detail coaching he is receiving.

Re: Gary Hetherington : Wed Jun 14, 2023 12:01 pm  

Come on, Hurrell's well into his 30s with a long NRL career behind him. He had all the skills before he joined Leeds or Sts. The only 'coaching' he needed was to be told to play with more discipline. Playing among better players in a team with a clear structure to their play does the rest.

Re: Gary Hetherington : Wed Jun 14, 2023 12:16 pm  

Once were Loiners wrote:

Come on, Hurrell's well into his 30s with a long NRL career behind him. He had all the skills before he joined Leeds or Sts. The only 'coaching' he needed was to be told to play with more discipline. Playing among better players in a team with a clear structure to their play does the rest.

I disagree - When Smith came to Leeds in 2004 the first thing he did was work the basics of catch and pass, PTB. He coached as if he were coaching kids.

Players get into bad habits even professionals - Hurrell carried the ball in a terrible position which result in numerous errors between the tackle and the PTB. Saints have definitely improved that area of his game. He also used to shoot out of the line all the time and create mayhem - this is much improved at Saints.

It could be he knows the level of performance tolerated at Leeds would not be acceptable at Saints so he had to take heed of the coaching or not play?

Re: Gary Hetherington : Wed Jun 14, 2023 12:28 pm  

batleyrhino wrote:

Who was the last very good coach GH brought in for the 1st Team? I ask as I think very good is the minimum standard we should be looking for.

Who was the last game breaking talent GH signed for the 1st Team? I ask as we seem desperately short of them.

Last night I was thinking, I know it hurt, about which players or coaches we have brought in since the 2017 GF that have actually been a roaring success. I couldn't make a case for any of them to be signed really, including the Leeds version of Konrad Hurrell who whilst entertaining was nothing like the St Helens version and wasn't really what we needed.

GH has gone so far off the boil from a playing and coaching side, he's barely even tepid.

Agree Batley. Recruitment has been simply awful and we are still paying the price. Depressing times

Re: Gary Hetherington : Wed Jun 14, 2023 12:30 pm  

Zoo Zoo Boom wrote:

I disagree - When Smith came to Leeds in 2004 the first thing he did was work the basics of catch and pass, PTB. He coached as if he were coaching kids.

Players get into bad habits even professionals - Hurrell carried the ball in a terrible position which result in numerous errors between the tackle and the PTB. Saints have definitely improved that area of his game. He also used to shoot out of the line all the time and create mayhem - this is much improved at Saints.

It could be he knows the level of performance tolerated at Leeds would not be acceptable at Saints so he had to take heed of the coaching or not play?

He was fatigued at Leeds ++ as he was doing the work of two players. He’s fresh and selective now, so less errors. They can even afford to test him, and allow proper recovery from injury….!

Re: Gary Hetherington : Wed Jun 14, 2023 1:34 pm  

Shabino wrote:

He was fatigued at Leeds ++ as he was doing the work of two players. He’s fresh and selective now, so less errors. They can even afford to test him, and allow proper recovery from injury….!

He was carrying the weight of two players - by his own admission he wasn't as fit as he should have been. Perhaps if he had of been his propensity to injury would have been significantly reduced.

Re: Gary Hetherington : Wed Jun 14, 2023 5:07 pm  

You could argue, has Hetherington ever been THAT savvy?

In the early years, you couldn’t really miss with overseas recruitment, with the exchange rate and the NRL-SL salary cap ratio.

Circa 98/99 was a short-term team, then the emergence of the golden generation which was circumstance rather than directly due to decision making. From there, they formed the basis of most success since.

There were good decisions which facilitated success. Smith, Bluey, and McDermott were perfect coaches for the golden generation at the respective times. Hetherington really peaked there. Though, you could argue beyond Smith any competent coach would have won with the spine that was there.

By and large though, I think player recruitment has been poor since circa 2010, and it was the golden generation spine that papered over the cracks for so long. That’s why it dropped off so fast when they excited.

Re: Gary Hetherington : Wed Jun 14, 2023 5:46 pm  

Is there anyone else apart from the pension top up pot man himself expect any different with a spine of Handley Austin Sezer/Myler and O',Connor plus waste of spacers Fussy Roberts Olpherts Bentley Lisone Donaldson. This crap isn't ending any time soon.

Re: Gary Hetherington : Fri Jun 16, 2023 3:02 pm  

I think it could be turned around quite quickly actually. This season is gone, but IF we get recruitment right we have the first chance in years to massively upgrade the team in key positions. We can replace the two worst marquee players in the competition (Tetevano and Fusitu'a) with genuine quality, and have overseas spots and other cap leaving as well. Combine that with what looks like real quality juniors coming through and we could be very competitive next year and beyond.

Get it wrong and we'll be plodding along for the next three or four years.

I just don't have much confidence we'll get it right.

Re: Gary Hetherington : Fri Jun 16, 2023 6:15 pm  

I'm not convinced we'll be blown away by any recruitment just don't see the players available or that we'd be a quality players first choice. Probably cust being moved on from wigan and ending up at leeds.