Re: For the love of God,Allah or whoever-McDermott GO!!! : Fri Jul 25, 2014 9:42 am  

ThePrinter wrote:

As has been mentioned for Cas it was a Sinfield brainfart and against Wakey we were missing a ton of experience on the pitch.

We still should've been able to (and would've done in the past in my opinion) get a drop goal over v Cas. Either before or after Sinfield's sending off.
V Wakey I think in the past we'd have ground it out and kept Wakey further away from our line to prevent them scoring their final try.

Re: For the love of God,Allah or whoever-McDermott GO!!! : Fri Jul 25, 2014 11:15 am  

Him wrote:

We still should've been able to (and would've done in the past in my opinion) get a drop goal over v Cas. Either before or after Sinfield's sending off.
V Wakey I think in the past we'd have ground it out and kept Wakey further away from our line to prevent them scoring their final try.

Tried the drop goal but it appears Peacock looks exactly like McGuire

Re: For the love of God,Allah or whoever-McDermott GO!!! : Fri Jul 25, 2014 11:20 am  

Gotcha wrote:

As for soft. I was speaking with Brett Ferres a couple of weeks back and he was giving it the same old same old, that always goes through the game, that Leeds have no underbelly, they do not like it when you are in their face, and too soft. I gave him the same line, of we have enough GF wins to show different, and his response was we are talking about two different teams mate.

Well if anyone know about a soft underbelly it's Brett Ferris.

Re: For the love of God,Allah or whoever-McDermott GO!!! : Fri Jul 25, 2014 12:25 pm  

Gotcha wrote:

I don't think the Cas result had anything to do with the Sinfield brainfart of the sending off. Unless you lot are not on about the sending off?

Yes, it was down to a Sinfield brainfart, but that was not going for the drop earlier, and using his head to win the game. With or without the sending off, the frustration had already set in, and Cas like they did last night, were always going to give it a last hurrahhhh.

I beg to differ. When Sinfield was sent off we were leading 24-18 and looking in control. To lose our main organiser, skipper and goal kicker was an enormous blow. His red carding gave Cas a huge lift and made Leeds minus a defender.

So it is nonsense to pretend that this didn't effect the result. Furthermore had Sinfield remained on the field it is more likely that he would have taken the latter drop goal attempt instead of JP with more chance of it going over so I would argue his sending off was easily the main reason for not winning. If you regard Sinfield not dropping a goal earlier as a brainfart then what do you call Bailey leaving a huge gap under the posts (6 points)

Re: For the love of God,Allah or whoever-McDermott GO!!! : Fri Jul 25, 2014 12:40 pm  

Juan Cornetto wrote:

I beg to differ. When Sinfield was sent off we were leading 24-18 and looking in control. To lose our main organiser, skipper and goal kicker was an enormous blow. His red carding gave Cas a huge lift and made Leeds minus a defender.

So it is nonsense to pretend that this didn't effect the result. Furthermore had Sinfield remained on the field it is more likely that he would have taken the latter drop goal attempt instead of JP with more chance of it going over so I would argue his sending off was easily the main reason for not winning. If you regard Sinfield not dropping a goal earlier as a brainfart then what do you call Bailey leaving a huge gap under the posts (6 points)

I will agree with you that he could have possibly got one right at the death where Peacock bombed (although potentially him taking the kick off could also have given a different play for Cas on the return), but I still disagree that his sending off had any more bearing on the result, than what he failed to do whilst he was on the pitch. It's those earlier minutes where a win was taken away from us, not the sending off.

Re: For the love of God,Allah or whoever-McDermott GO!!! : Fri Jul 25, 2014 1:24 pm  

Gotcha wrote:

I will agree with you that he could have possibly got one right at the death where Peacock bombed (although potentially him taking the kick off could also have given a different play for Cas on the return), but I still disagree that his sending off had any more bearing on the result, than what he failed to do whilst he was on the pitch. It's those earlier minutes where a win was taken away from us, not the sending off.

But with 8 minutes to go we were 6 points up andhad momentum. Cas looked to be down and it was the sending off that revived them and our being a man down. You have to agree that this factors were crucial. However I do agree with you that defensive errors gave away a couple of soft scores but in such a high tempo game this can happen to both sides.

Re: For the love of God,Allah or whoever-McDermott GO!!! : Fri Jul 25, 2014 1:57 pm  

Juan Cornetto wrote:

But with 8 minutes to go we were 6 points up andhad momentum. Cas looked to be down and it was the sending off that revived them and our being a man down. You have to agree that this factors were crucial. However I do agree with you that defensive errors gave away a couple of soft scores but in such a high tempo game this can happen to both sides.

Actually, I think there is a confusion about the sending off and the fact he had already been pinned for the holding down. The sending off came from the resulting arguing. Cas moved down field from the original foul, and awarded two further penalties to give them the try scoring opportunity. This is why I personally say the sending off was not the reason we did not win the game.

We had enough field position, and enough ball, to have won that game in the 20 minutes before his sending off, and that's not even considering the first half, as far as I am concerned. It was those brain farts that stopped the win.

Re: For the love of God,Allah or whoever-McDermott GO!!! : Fri Jul 25, 2014 3:47 pm  

We should have been more than 6 points up before Sinfield was sent off. We'd already butchered a routine drop-goal chance when Aiton threw a terrible pass to McGuire, where otherwise McGuire could have popped it over or flicked it on to Sinfield who was waiting in the pocket. There was also a Hardaker break where you'd have backed him to score but he was taken by an excellent Sneyd tackle, but then McGuire messed up the next play where a quick pass blindside would have been a walk-in and we wasted our set of six.

However if Sinfield hadn't been sent off and we were defending with 13 men rather than 12 then obviously we'd have been much more likely to close out the game 6 points up whether or not we scored any more.

Re: For the love of God,Allah or whoever-McDermott GO!!! : Fri Jul 25, 2014 4:32 pm  

Am I the only one who remembers that Sinfield DID attempt a drop goal (about 2 minutes before his sending off) and it was charged down with Hardaker running back to collect for another set of 6?

Or the previous set when 2m out on the 5th, Hardaker tried to crash over from dummy half ala Kieron Cunningham style?

Re: For the love of God,Allah or whoever-McDermott GO!!! : Fri Jul 25, 2014 4:42 pm  

Him wrote:

We still should've been able to (and would've done in the past in my opinion) get a drop goal over v Cas. Either before or after Sinfield's sending off.
V Wakey I think in the past we'd have ground it out and kept Wakey further away from our line to prevent them scoring their final try.

In times gone past we might've done but the team usually wasn't missing as many starters (and if Moon stays on at centre instead of Walters getting caught out we probably still win). I'm not trying to have a pop at Walters because he's done very well since he came in but he did get done there and on one or two other occasions and it happens with the younger guys.

For how good the likes of Sinfield, Burrow, McGuire etc became at winning the tight games they also had the narrow defeats in the 2003 playoffs and CC Final, lost to Bradford in the 2004 playoffs (before gaining revenge) and narrow defeats in the 2005 CC and GF. I'd say this 'golden generation' didn't become good at winning the close games until McClennen took over and at that point they'd already won 2 GF's and WCC.

Even the guys who became experts at winning the close games had to have their failures first, and it's perhaps understandable that with a chunk of them missing a less experienced side came up just short, with a bit of a rookie mistake leading to the winning try.