Re: RD 7 | Warrington Wolves (H) : Thu Apr 11, 2024 10:08 am  

I think we’re disagreeing on the reasons why we are in our own red zone too much of the time rather than how bad it is to be there.

I don’t think our defence is as “passive” as is being made out, on the whole. I think it’s become a bandwagon. I think lots of fans have had enough of RS.

I’m not saying he will or should be coach into 2025 yet; but personally my mind isn’t made up on him. We changed McDemrott. We changed Furner. We changed Agar. Where has it got us? We just change the coach every year or two until magical things happen?

I think the squad is a hell of a lot closer to where it needs to be now than when RS took over. I can see us competing with the big boys IF (big if) we can find and attract 2-3 real high quality additions. I coukdn’t say that at any time in the last 7 years.

Re: RD 7 | Warrington Wolves (H) : Thu Apr 11, 2024 10:13 am  

I agree with you Jim, but I think it's going to take the emergence of more young talent from within the club (not just signings) if we're really going to turn things around.

Too early to write off this season though.

Re: RD 7 | Warrington Wolves (H) : Thu Apr 11, 2024 11:11 am  

Yep, you need at least a handful of your stars to be from your academy, preferably in the pivot positions, as they tend to cost less on the cap. I'm not really sure we can afford to bring in more stars from outside the club, unless players leave

Re: RD 7 | Warrington Wolves (H) : Thu Apr 11, 2024 12:44 pm  

Didn't sky say we were 300k under budget ?.

Either way, end of this season we should have the cap space from Olpherts,Fusitua and Donaldson plus any left from Myler and cap above if true.
Maybe even money from Martin if he wants to move.

More than enough for the three players we need ( of high quality, no projects) to balance the squad

Re: RD 7 | Warrington Wolves (H) : Thu Apr 11, 2024 1:13 pm  

Emagdnim13 wrote: Didn't sky say we were 300k under budget ?. Either way, end of this season we should have the cap space from Olpherts,Fusitua and Donaldson plus any left from Myler and cap above if true. Maybe even money from Martin if he wants to move. More than enough for the three players we need ( of high quality, no projects) to balance the squad We have the joint 4th highest wage bill according to this graphic from sky. We're spending the same has Saints and Huddersfield, but less than Warrington, Catalans, and Wigan. https://twitter.com/johnnyddavidson/sta ... 5X3cw&s=19

Emagdnim13 wrote: Didn't sky say we were 300k under budget ?. Either way, end of this season we should have the cap space from Olpherts,Fusitua and Donaldson plus any left from Myler and cap above if true. Maybe even money from Martin if he wants to move. More than enough for the three players we need ( of high quality, no projects) to balance the squad We have the joint 4th highest wage bill according to this graphic from sky. We're spending the same has Saints and Huddersfield, but less than Warrington, Catalans, and Wigan. https://twitter.com/johnnyddavidson/sta ... 5X3cw&s=19

Re: RD 7 | Warrington Wolves (H) : Thu Apr 11, 2024 4:21 pm  

Jack Burton wrote:

Yep, you need at least a handful of your stars to be from your academy, preferably in the pivot positions, as they tend to cost less on the cap. I'm not really sure we can afford to bring in more stars from outside the club, unless players leave

Yes in theory but a lot then hangs on how good those ex academy lads actually are..

Re: RD 7 | Warrington Wolves (H) : Thu Apr 11, 2024 4:25 pm  

KaeruJim wrote:

I think we’re disagreeing on the reasons why we are in our own red zone too much of the time rather than how bad it is to be there.

I don’t think our defence is as “passive” as is being made out, on the whole. I think it’s become a bandwagon. I think lots of fans have had enough of RS.
.

I don’t know if Rohan Smith has encouraged a “passive” style of defence and if he has actually coached systems to that effect. If he has he should be on his bike right now because it’s the daftest thing I’ve ever heard in my life and it’s clearly not working. I’m thinking we look passive because the players aren’t physically strong enough and lack endurance therefore they end up on the back foot getting steamrollered towards their own line. It’s the same when we are trying to get off our own line, like little boys in year 3 trying to compete and get past the bigger lads in year 5. I think if anything is being coached to be “passive” it’s our attacking strategy in the opponents half, and that’s what annoys me about Rohan Smith. The buck stops with him on that one, and that’s what annoys a lot of fans.

Re: RD 7 | Warrington Wolves (H) : Thu Apr 11, 2024 5:58 pm  

Jack Burton wrote: We have the joint 4th highest wage bill according to this graphic from sky. We're spending the same has Saints and Huddersfield, but less than Warrington, Catalans, and Wigan. https://twitter.com/johnnyddavidson/sta ... 5X3cw&s=19 We might have to bite the bullet and spend the most for a couple of years... I'm not for buying success, but there is still this little hump of quality we're struggling to get over. There is some talent in the youth for sure, but I'm not sure I see another Danny Mags or Adrian Morley in there currently.

Jack Burton wrote: We have the joint 4th highest wage bill according to this graphic from sky. We're spending the same has Saints and Huddersfield, but less than Warrington, Catalans, and Wigan. https://twitter.com/johnnyddavidson/sta ... 5X3cw&s=19 We might have to bite the bullet and spend the most for a couple of years... I'm not for buying success, but there is still this little hump of quality we're struggling to get over. There is some talent in the youth for sure, but I'm not sure I see another Danny Mags or Adrian Morley in there currently.

Re: RD 7 | Warrington Wolves (H) : Thu Apr 11, 2024 6:02 pm  

leeds owl wrote:

I don’t know if Rohan Smith has encouraged a “passive” style of defence and if he has actually coached systems to that effect. If he has he should be on his bike right now because it’s the daftest thing I’ve ever heard in my life and it’s clearly not working. I’m thinking we look passive because the players aren’t physically strong enough and lack endurance therefore they end up on the back foot getting steamrollered towards their own line. It’s the same when we are trying to get off our own line, like little boys in year 3 trying to compete and get past the bigger lads in year 5. I think if anything is being coached to be “passive” it’s our attacking strategy in the opponents half, and that’s what annoys me about Rohan Smith. The buck stops with him on that one, and that’s what annoys a lot of fans.

Our line speed has been p* poor at times, I don't like that don't get me wrong. But it hasn't been all the time - our D looks worse IMO primarily because errors and penalties keep putting us in rubbish positions.

We have had spells in attack where we end sets better than last year with a nice attacking kick, but I thought against Wire we weren't as good - aside from the nice kicks from Croft to Roberts and Frawley for Newman.

Re: RD 7 | Warrington Wolves (H) : Thu Apr 11, 2024 7:06 pm  

The line speed noticeably improves in the second half.
Which makes it feel like a deliberate tactic.
Soak up the pressure in the first half and then apply pressure in the second when there are tired legs.

Will occasionally work against poorer teams or teams not in form (see Cas, Leigh, Cats games).
Won't work against better teams or teams bang in form (see Saints and Wire games).

Not a sustainable strategy for me.
I'm all for trying new things, but if things don't work you have to adapt and be prepared to change.
Not sure with RS on that front.