The Bradford "legacy" : Fri Feb 27, 2009 11:35 pm  

I posted this on the Wigan board just wondering your thoughts on it.....



I appreciate i leave myself open to criticism for posting such thoughts but here goes another one.

Rugby League being such a localised sport filled with basically players and coaches who know each other inside out and given the fact we as a sport seem to relish this fact rather than looking to grow our knowledge and embrace new thinking I guess it is inevitable that successfull players from successfull teams seem to at least be given a shot at coaching.

In the John Monie book he lists or at least the forward list the number of players that have gone on to coach at the top level who played under Monie.

I am a huge believer in the theory that you are a product of your environment, and i think that the Bradford Legacy is very visable.

Wigan, Warrington and Bradford themselves all have coaches at all levels that did there apprenticships or were involved in the successfull period at Bradford, and all these team continue to falter to decieve despite signing on paper quality players.

The skill level of the 3 teams highlighted is poor and rather the emphasis is on the physical side of things. Wire look a huge side this year, having taken on the Bradford Reserve conditioner at the end of last year with Jimmy Lowes.

Wigan have Noble and Foreshaw who cut there teeth in the Bradford era of success/laying the foundations of success, and Bradford themselves have McNamarra and another conditioning coach who came through the same system.

The teams on paper are far superior to the performances on the field, they all play a very basic game plan, and rely on an individual spark to fire them.

I think the Brian Smith and Bradford legacy is evident today and harming the 3 teams in question.

I would also add i do not think Brian Smith is a poor coach, he simply identified a way for the Bradford team to succeed and played to it, he is not limited to this coaching style but those who learned the game under the systems and in the environment he created are.

: Sat Feb 28, 2009 12:07 am  

Brian Smith coached Bradford to play some lovely rugby in 1996. The problem is the legacy left by Matthew Elliot. He introduced the boring but successful land of the slow giant team - look at tapes of his years in charge and you see the style of play change and decline from the Brian Smith style. Sadly because Elliot won trophies, that became your style under subsequent coaches. You need a clear out and a change in the mind set of the club.

Clubs like Saints and Leeds have a mind set of open fast rugby - even though we won nowt for years. Wigan do too which is why their fans dislike Noble.

Tony Smith and Justin Morgan are 2 Brian Smith products who follow his open style of play which adds to my argument that Elliot began the rot

: Sat Feb 28, 2009 12:11 am  

Rhinos Fan Pam wrote:

Brian Smith coached Bradford to play some lovely rugby in 1996. The problem is the legacy left by Matthew Elliot. He introduced the boring but successful land of the slow giant team - look at tapes of his years in charge and you see the style of play change and decline from the Brian Smith style. Sadly because Elliot won trophies, that became your style under subsequent coaches. You need a clear out and a change in the mind set of the club.

Clubs like Saints and Leeds have a mind set of open fast rugby - even though we won nowt for years. Wigan do too which is why their fans dislike Noble.

Tony Smith and Justin Morgan are 2 Brian Smith products who follow his open style of play which adds to my argument that Elliot began the rot

Good post, i would though argue Smith planted the seed Elliot nurtured it and the coaches named are the resultant crop. (nice even if i do say so myself! )

: Sat Feb 28, 2009 12:18 am  

Way too highbrow - you'll get banned for thinking too deeply instead of just blaming every ref who's ever been in charge of a loss!

: Sat Feb 28, 2009 12:22 am  

Your pack is class.

Your half-backs are average.

Your backs are shocking.

: Sat Feb 28, 2009 12:26 am  

Daniel Anderson is also a product of B Smiths legacy. But not the Bradford one.

: Sat Feb 28, 2009 12:35 am  

While I think the original post does have some basis in it, if you think the rugby being played under Elliott was anything like that played by the team between 2001-2003, and 2005 when they got out of the early season malaise, then you are totally deluded, Elliott's sides won 2 trophies in 4 seasons and by the end it made very painful viewing.

Not as painful as the current lot mind.

: Sat Feb 28, 2009 12:40 am  

Asim wrote:

While I think the original post does have some basis in it, if you think the rugby being played under Elliott was anything like that played by the team between 2001-2003, and 2005 when they got out of the early season malaise, then you are totally deluded, Elliott's sides won 2 trophies in 4 seasons and by the end it made very painful viewing.

Not as painful as the current lot mind.

Compered to the current fair we a re being treated to the rugby we played under Elliott Was like watching Leeds and Saints.

: Sat Feb 28, 2009 12:40 am  

Asim wrote:

While I think the original post does have some basis in it, if you think the rugby being played under Elliott was anything like that played by the team between 2001-2003, and 2005 when they got out of the early season malaise, then you are totally deluded, Elliott's sides won 2 trophies in 4 seasons and by the end it made very painful viewing.

Not as painful as the current lot mind.

The principle was the same thought.

: Sat Feb 28, 2009 8:07 am  

Would Leeds or Saints opt to kick for goal with 3 penalties?
No, especially not at home!!!

It's negative, boring and shows the opposition far too much respect, rather than being positive and intimidating by nearly always running penalties and going for the try.

The game has moved on. Leeds & Saints have raised the bar, and Bradford, Wigan, Warrington are too slow to change.

The 'Bradford' connection really shows, and if I were a fan, I'd be worried my team have been left behind.

Bradford need a new coach, and new direction on the field to have any chance of challenging for trophies again.