: Sat Apr 18, 2009 5:59 pm  

Block5Bull wrote:

Roughly how much do we reckon we're talking here? I couldn't even begin to speculate myself. How long is left on Macca's contract nyway?

We had all this out on a thread a bit back - I guess I could go find the link.

It anyway depends on whether he is contracted to end 2009 (as most people think/thought) or 2010 (as Hood suggested in an interview with Sledger a few weeks ago.

I'm not really in a position to speculate on exactly how much his package is worth - not least cos I really have no specific idea! But remember to add in the car (no doubt part of the JCT600 sponsorship?) and other benefits to whatever the salary is. And is it conceivable that a SL Head Coach would be on, lets say £50k pa? Or would people expect rather more than that? And then its a question of whether his contract gives specific rights in event of termination, and whether a compromise agreement would be likely (I assume so) in which case that would cost the club. There are loads of factors which could affect the amount - including employee duty to mitigate the loss, tax treatment and avoiding enrichment. I've always assumed any settlement would have to run well into six figures, but I'm really only speculating. Remember also you'd likely have a chunk of Employers' NIC to pay as well.

: Sat Apr 18, 2009 6:07 pm  

Adeybull wrote:

We had all this out on a thread a bit back - I guess I could go find the link.

It anyway depends on whether he is contracted to end 2009 (as most people think/thought) or 2010 (as Hood suggested in an interview with Sledger a few weeks ago.

I'm not really in a position to speculate on exactly how much his package is worth - not least cos I really have no specific idea! But remember to add in the car (no doubt part of the JCT600 sponsorship?) and other benefits to whatever the salary is. And is it conceivable that a SL Head Coach would be on, lets say £50k pa? Or would people expect rather more than that? And then its a question of whether his contract gives specific rights in event of termination, and whether a compromise agreement would be likely (I assume so) in which case that would cost the club. There are loads of factors which could affect the amount - including employee duty to mitigate the loss, tax treatment and avoiding enrichment. I've always assumed any settlement would have to run well into six figures, but I'm really only speculating. Remember also you'd likely have a chunk of Employers' NIC to pay as well.

Thanks. A lot then potentially!! Makes you wonder why it seems to happen so regularly then with some teams.

Sorry, missed the previous thread.

: Sat Apr 18, 2009 6:10 pm  

Ok, genuine question...

...do coaches have some kind of performance expectation in their contract? For example, the contract is null and void if the team don't achieve..such and such?

In my job, as in most I should imagine, I have regular performance reviews and if I don't perform to expected standards, I could be sacked. I wouldn't get a big pay off because I'm being made jobless before the end of my contract.

So why is a coach or a player exempt? If you don't perform, why should they expect to be retained or paid off?

: Sat Apr 18, 2009 6:11 pm  

Block5Bull wrote:

Thanks. A lot then potentially!! Makes you wonder why it seems to happen so regularly then with some teams.

Sorry, missed the previous thread.

Potentially yes COULD be a lot. But it COULD be a lot less too, in fairness. In what I do for a living, prudence is drilled into you, mind!

A team with a rich benefactor will likely find it much easier to find the funds necessary, I guess.

: Sat Apr 18, 2009 6:18 pm  

debaser wrote:

Ok, genuine question...

...do coaches have some kind of performance expectation in their contract? For example, the contract is null and void if the team don't achieve..such and such?

In my job, as in most I should imagine, I have regular performance reviews and if I don't perform to expected standards, I could be sacked. I wouldn't get a big pay off because I'm being made jobless before the end of my contract.

So why is a coach or a player exempt? If you don't perform, why should they expect to be retained or paid off?

I don't know a great deal on this but the word of sporting contracts is very different to other areas of employment. Being able to sack purely on the basis of performance really would open up a can of worms - we'd probably only have Morrison, Menzies, Burgess, Lynch and Nero turning up each day knowing they'd still have a job at the end of the day right now as everyone else would be in breach.

: Sat Apr 18, 2009 6:20 pm  

Like I have said previously we are a club in transition. There is no short term solution, all the best players are already at clubs and will not be enticed away to Bulls. We are in for the long haul, while relegation is not an issue we have time to rebuild, lets take the nettle by the hand as painful as it would be to languish in the bottom of SL. Sack the "superstars" who have no pride in pulling a Bulls shirt on clear the decks and start the rebuild, to challenge for honours come 2012/3. All else is delusion and pie in the sky. Support the Head Coach and stop booing guys on the pitch who bodies are on the line.

: Sat Apr 18, 2009 6:20 pm  

Also, you've only got to look at this forum to see how difficult it is to nail responsibility for team performance on the coach. That said, it's pretty much beyond doubt now.

: Sat Apr 18, 2009 6:23 pm  

Block5Bull wrote:

I don't know a great deal on this but the word of sporting contracts is very different to other areas of employment. Being able to sack purely on the basis of performance really would open up a can of worms - we'd probably only have Morrison, Menzies, Burgess, Lynch and Nero turning up each day knowing they'd still have a job at the end of the day right now as everyone else would be in breach.

Yes I see that, but a coach? It would not be unreasonable to have it in a coaches contract before he (or she!) signed:

We are giving you these players, this much money, etc and in return the minimum we expect would be....

If they didn't like it they would not have to sign it!

: Sat Apr 18, 2009 6:31 pm  

debaser wrote:

Yes I see that, but a coach? It would not be unreasonable to have it in a coaches contract before he (or she!) signed:

We are giving you these players, this much money, etc and in return the minimum we expect would be....

If they didn't like it they would not have to sign it!

For things off the pitch, professional misconduct, etc, the coach is subject to the sack just like anyone else. As such it would seem reasonable that the answer to your question must be down to the fact that there's just too many variables to be able to demonstrate that what happens on the pitch is 100% down to the performance of the coach rather than well trained but ultimately unlucky or erratic players on the day. (if you see what i mean)

: Sat Apr 18, 2009 6:50 pm  

debaser wrote:

Yes I see that, but a coach? It would not be unreasonable to have it in a coaches contract before he (or she!) signed:

We are giving you these players, this much money, etc and in return the minimum we expect would be....

If they didn't like it they would not have to sign it!

Be a bit hard to come up with anything workable when you have issues like injuries to queer the pitch?