: Sun Jun 28, 2009 11:03 pm  

Terry Monster wrote:

You seem to be up on the academy and reserves, is there anything that is now different now under the stewardship of Macca to when it was when Noble was at the helm in regards to lower grades. There's been a lot of talk that there was a blatent disregard for the academy, is this true and is the academy now in a better position to produce players to the first team?

In a word no. One major difference is the level of coaching the receive now isn't a patch on before Baz Richards and Phill Tate aren't in the same league as Phil Vievers, Darrell Shelford, Mick Slicker Macca himself, Bernie Dwyer.

: Sun Jun 28, 2009 11:33 pm  

Asim wrote:

Has he been "building for the future" by bringing in older second rower after second rower, stifling the progress of Matt Cook?

The good thing about coming up with these slogans is that they do work on plenty of people, but they'll need to come up with some new ones before too long if things don't change on the pitch.

I think tbf the bringing in of older more experienced players could have helped Cook to progress, but atm I can't see Cook being anything more than a back-up player. Whilst maybe being solid in defence etc. he doesn't really offer us anything special.

: Mon Jun 29, 2009 12:50 am  

Asim wrote:

"McNamara good, Noble bad" seems to be the accepted mantra when it comes to youth development now,

No it doesn't. The current setup is greatly improved on youth development, and we have all heard and read the details, and that the youth setup is very much better now seems undeniable. The 'before and after' comparison certainly isn't as black and white as your mocking suggests, but it does seem to be a fact that we are devoting much more resources and structure to youth development than we were. You're the only one I've heard claim such a simplistic mantra.

Asim wrote:

however as we were told the club was losing money hand over fist, while spending up to (and over) the cap when Caisley was in charge -

We were? Who by? Or more to the point, given that all the accounts are in the public domain, why do we need to "be told" anything, when we can just look?

What the previous regime did not predict is the financial disaster that was Harrisgate. Which regime has had to pick up that wallet and run with it? Needless to say, the Caisley regime didn't budget for the financial debacle it all became.

Asim wrote:

so where exactly were the resources going to come from to employ the coaching/scouting staff for more "focus" on youth development?

Any business has to organise its affairs in the way it thinks most cost-effective. Your question sounds like you believe the resources couldn't be raised. But, obviously, they have been, and so I don't really get your point here.

Asim wrote:

Does McNamara feel so strongly about it that he is paying for it out of his own pocket? Good man!

Hearing him speak on the subject, he clearly does feel strongly about it. Suggesting that he should "pay for it out of his wn pocket", or seemingly criticising him because he plainly isn't, seems a bit of a nutty point, wouldn't you say on reflection?

Asim wrote:

As has been said it's good spin to deflect away from the under-performance at first team level across the recruitment, coaching and playing areas.

doubt, given that until very recently hardly any public discussion or explanation has been forthcoming. But then, if by the time it does come out, all they can expect is people calling it "spin", perhaps they were right not to bother.

Asim wrote:

Was McNamara "building for the future" when he brought in McAvoy to block Dave Halley's progress to the first team?

Very possibly, if you look at Halley now, and compare him with the Halley of then.

Asim wrote:

Was he "building for the future" when he brought in the erratic Solomona jettisoning Brett Ferres as part of the deal? Has he been "building for the future" by bringing in older second rower after second rower, stifling the progress of Matt Cook?

I was sad to see Ferres go, but he's not much more than a journeyman, whereas Solomona has genuine class. His signing hasn't exactly worked out, but anyone can get injured, and no player is ever going to be evertone's cup of tea.

I realy can't imagine why anyone would say Matt Cook's progress has "been stifled".

Asim wrote:

The good thing about coming up with these slogans is that they do work on plenty of people, ...

You mean the slogan you just came up with? Because I'm struggling to think of any "slogan" coming from the club like you suggest. And if there is one, then on who is it working?

: Mon Jun 29, 2009 7:00 am  

redeverready wrote:

In a word no. One major difference is the level of coaching the receive now isn't a patch on before Baz Richards and Phill Tate aren't in the same league as Phil Vievers, Darrell Shelford, Mick Slicker Macca himself, Bernie Dwyer.

I was thinking that yesterday while watching Wigan save Noble's butt for another week - the quality of Wigan's backroom staff was impressive - (I think I saw) Phil Veivers, Mike Forshaw, David Lyon, John Pendlebury & Shaun Wane.

: Mon Jun 29, 2009 12:18 pm  

I think Macca will already know what needs doing to the squad for next season.

Currently (without any recruitment or retention) this is what we would look like next season.

Platt
Sheriffe
CENTRE
Nero
Halley
Stand Off
Deacon
Lynch
Godwin
Hall
Burgess
Worrincy
Langley

Scruton
Kopzcak
Whitehead
Donaldson


OUT (some will probably be retained)

Menzies ( retain)
Morrison (A tricky one)
Jeffries (We need better quality whilst we still have Deacon under contract)
Tadulala (Deserves another yr imo)
Sykes (We need better quality, but may be retained due to being HG)

I do think we need to retain Menzies ASAP, and if Morrison goes we will need someone to replace him. We also need a strike centre and some real quality put into the halves. With the addition of Hall I think we look good at prop next season and hopefully Burgess will be used at LF and Langley can revert to SR.

: Mon Jun 29, 2009 12:21 pm  

tigertot wrote:

I was thinking that yesterday while watching Wigan save Noble's butt for another week - the quality of Wigan's backroom staff was impressive - (I think I saw) Phil Veivers, Mike Forshaw, David Lyon, John Pendlebury & Shaun Wane.

Another way of looking at it could be that if Wigan's backroom staf are so good why are they not in a better position. Maybe too uch importance is attached to them.

A more worrying issue for me is OSV. We have had a poor season by anyone's standards and the crowds have drifted away. With the impending temporary move away from Odsal, while the redevelopment goes on, how many more people will take the opportunity to have a break from watching the Bulls.

: Mon Jun 29, 2009 12:21 pm  

rugbyreddog wrote:

A more worrying issue for me is OSV. We have had a poor season by anyone's standards and the crowds have drifted away. With the impending temporary move away from Odsal, while the redevelopment goes on, how many more people will take the opportunity to have a break from watching the Bulls.

Not me, however much I hate VP.

: Mon Jun 29, 2009 12:26 pm  

rugbyreddog wrote:

Another way of looking at it could be that if Wigan's backroom staf are so good why are they not in a better position. Maybe too uch importance is attached to them.

A more worrying issue for me is OSV. We have had a poor season by anyone's standards and the crowds have drifted away. With the impending temporary move away from Odsal, while the redevelopment goes on, how many more people will take the opportunity to have a break from watching the Bulls.

Have faith we'll go on a decent run from now on. A couple of wins and all will be forgotten.

: Tue Jun 30, 2009 12:49 pm  

In general I think the club is heading in the right direction, but there are some underlying shortfalls that need rectifying ASAP if the club intends to re-establish itself as a contender.

1. Defense, defense, defense. Ours is inconsistent at best, and you can't win games when you concede so many points.

2. Substitutions. McNamara appears to have little or no awareness of when to substitute players and how best to use his subs to have maximum impact. He brings off players when they're looking like they're just getting warmed up and brings players on with less than 10 minutes to play not giving them the chance to get warmed up!


By the looks of things the junior set up seems to be doing ok and we're producing some decent talent, but there's no point in producing the players if they don't get bled into the first team properly and are given at least a 20 minute spell to get involved.

: Tue Jun 30, 2009 12:58 pm  

rugbyreddog wrote:

Another way of looking at it could be that if Wigan's backroom staf are so good why are they not in a better position.

Perhaps they have a crap head coach.