: Wed Apr 08, 2009 7:28 am  

odd that of all the kids picked seven are now playing for other teams?

: Wed Apr 08, 2009 9:15 am  

Terry Monster wrote:

Anybody would think a game at home against Leeds is way to much to ask a teenage Super League player to make his debut the way some people are carrying on. Whether we win lose or draw a bit of exposure will not ruin a young mans career. It's time we stood up and stop being so soft and use the junior talent that we have when our established men are quite clearly not performing to the standards that are required from them.

Probably not ruin anyone's career but making wholesale changes isn't going to help either the team or the individuals. You'd hope to introduce young players alongside experienced pro's who can give them guidance. Then it becomes a learning experience for them win lose or draw. Introducing someone into a half back position already puts a lot of pressure on them (other players looking to them for plays) and doing it in a high profile game just increases that.
Nobody wants to see a young player make a mess of his debut and anyone who isn't affected by that would be truly remarkable and should already be in the team anyway.

: Wed Apr 08, 2009 11:40 am  

Bullseye wrote:

I'd be careful. When Wigan were going through a spell like ours under Millward they played a lot of youngsters who took years to get over the experience..............I remember in 98 Matt Elliott was forced by injury and loss of form to give a few youngsters a shot....Paul Deacon

I knew there was a reason somewhere.

: Wed Apr 08, 2009 11:43 am  

Bullseye wrote:

Whitehead and Olbison have been named in the squad this season already so maybe they're first in the queue? Then there's Donaldson too.

I remember in 98 Matt Elliott was forced by injury and loss of form to give a few youngsters a shot. They were aged between 16 and 19. Their names were Paul Deacon, Stuart Fielden and Leon Pryce. Now I don't know if we have any prospects like that but it's worth a shot playing them at some stage soon.

Remember Deacon already had played quite a few SL games with Oldham so wasn't exactly untried. We just decided to put him in the academy when we signed him

: Wed Apr 08, 2009 12:00 pm  

ex Bull Dog wrote:

Remember Deacon already had played quite a few SL games with Oldham so wasn't exactly untried. We just decided to put him in the academy when we signed him

Not to go on about this but i feel he should probably have stayed in the academy.

: Wed Apr 08, 2009 2:05 pm  

childofthenorthern wrote:

Probably not ruin anyone's career but making wholesale changes isn't going to help either the team or the individuals. You'd hope to introduce young players alongside experienced pro's who can give them guidance. Then it becomes a learning experience for them win lose or draw. Introducing someone into a half back position already puts a lot of pressure on them (other players looking to them for plays) and doing it in a high profile game just increases that.
Nobody wants to see a young player make a mess of his debut and anyone who isn't affected by that would be truly remarkable and should already be in the team anyway.

I'm not saying make wholealse changes, what I'm saying is make 1 or 2 changes and drop players who are clearly not playing well. 1 or 2 players on Friday would have at least 13 established pro's around them to give them guidance, perhaps more depending on what you'd class as an experienced player. I'm not saying throw the whole academy team on and send them to the slaughter, but give somebody a chance, freshen things up and show complacent 1st teamers that their positions are under threat. What's to say a debutant would make a mess anyway? He might be a shining light in a winning team or a losing team, if we dont try them then we will never know. The opposition shouldn't determine when a player makes his debut, that's a daft statement in my books.

: Wed Apr 08, 2009 2:11 pm  

Terry Monster wrote:

I'm not saying make wholealse changes, what I'm saying is make 1 or 2 changes and drop players who are clearly not playing well. 1 or 2 players on Friday would have at least 13 established pro's around them to give them guidance, perhaps more depending on what you'd class as an experienced player. I'm not saying throw the whole academy team on and send them to the slaughter, but give somebody a chance, freshen things up and show complacent 1st teamers that their positions are under threat. What's to say a debutant would make a mess anyway? He might be a shining light in a winning team or a losing team, if we dont try them then we will never know. The opposition shouldn't determine when a player makes his debut, that's a daft statement in my books.

it's more a case of the 13 or so established pros who can't seem to get their own act together as a team.

: Wed Apr 08, 2009 2:13 pm  

phillgee wrote:

it's more a case of the 13 or so established pros who can't seem to get their own act together as a team.

So then make a few changes. It might work. What is the point in playing the same team, every week that clearly is not working?

: Wed Apr 08, 2009 4:12 pm  

Terry Monster wrote:

So then make a few changes. It might work. What is the point in playing the same team, every week that clearly is not working?

The point I was trying to make was about putting inexperienced half backs (or any other play making position for that matter) into a generally poorly performing team. As we've seen confidence can make a big difference to performance and I'd rather see players brought in to games where the team has a better chance of competing and not put straight under pressure.
There might be a few who can be dropped straight in and play without nerves but they are probably the exception and would likely have been selected before now.

Of course you could be right and they'd revel in being given a chance.

: Wed Apr 08, 2009 4:47 pm  

childofthenorthern wrote:

The point I was trying to make was about putting inexperienced half backs (or any other play making position for that matter) into a generally poorly performing team. As we've seen confidence can make a big difference to performance and I'd rather see players brought in to games where the team has a better chance of competing and not put straight under pressure.
There might be a few who can be dropped straight in and play without nerves but they are probably the exception and would likely have been selected before now.

Of course you could be right and they'd revel in being given a chance.

I was reading something else and and I would like to apply in responce to your post what one Australian rugby league fan says in regards to playing young players, it's kind of along similar lines to what I am saying and I strongly agree with what they are saying.

He or she i'm not sure which said this.

That is pure tosh. In the NRL, we throw the kids in the NRL level every week. There are dozens of them coming through all the time. Our coaches don't worry if they are 'ready' as you say. Coaches accept they are rookies and don't expect them to be as good as the experienced players, and fans don't expect it either. But fans, coaches and the young players will draw confidence that they are been given the chance, and we all know that the best place to develop is right there in the top grade itself.

And as an extra to that I would just like to add a few things. Every half back is inexperienced at some point in his career and many have started in teams under pressure, he's only going to get experience by being played. It doesn't matter who the game is against, play the lad if he's got talent. Look at the kid Mitchell Pearce, dropped into first grade at 17 in a struggling Sydney Roosters side in 2007, a year later he's New South Wales half back. First team exposure is good for young players, not keeping them wrapped upin cotton wool in reserve grades. A more recent example, look at that kid Sam Tomkins, playing in a strugglin Wigan side, he's high on confidence and playing well, Richard Myler, playing for Salford, there all kids being exposed to super league and its doing their games the world of good.