Re: Centurions Application for SL 2021 : Mon Dec 07, 2020 4:25 am  

Cokey wrote:

I agree that's what will happen. Mr. B did say if Leigh wasn't the chosen club,then he thinks it should be Toulouse. Would he go mad if it was the Bulls? probably not,just disappointed that it wasn't Leigh.

Thanks. By "disappointed it wasn't Leigh" do you mean it (probably won't be) Leigh chosen for a free ride into Superleague?

I'm used to fans saying that they want their club to win promotion not be given it?

Surely a blast through the Championship 2021 will be fun before the hard work begins 2022??

Re: Centurions / Newcastle Application for SL 2021 : Mon Dec 07, 2020 9:57 am  

Here are your applications in full with the Public Relations and aren't we blooming wonderful stuff taken out

BRADFORD Proven big achievements in Superleague and one of the best academies going. Ownership group with good personal track records, plan to also bring the "iconic" ground up to scratch.

FEATHERSTONE Excellent ground and facilities built up over the recent years, and if Superleague needs big well attended derbies then Fev.v.Cas and Fev.v. Wakefield will put four of them into the Superleague calendar. Best management of finances in the championship.

LEIGH - We will have a Visible cash investment waiting (not promises), will provide an SL quality squad, and will play at our World Cup facility P.S. If Bradford get in I (Derek) will accept they had a better proposition (even if they didn't!!)

LONDON - Academy expanding the player base in numbers and geography, only just lost their SL status by points difference, London open the game to the national media the club has several partnerships with commercial brands in the pipeline.

YORK - Easy rail access and a great day out in an iconic city that can take in the Rugby and the history. 366 pubs!!!!! £50M stadium complex.

As you can see Derek just about conceded the Bulls are in first......

My take is these are great clubs and it's a shame we can't go to 14 to get several of them in. But if the game slims down to two divisions under the new SKY deal 2020 then the second tier will have some great clubs, and a great competition if they salary cap it......

Your take may see some of this as very good points and some of this as flim-flam. You choose which club it should be.............

(source: Todays Rugby leaguer and League Express)

Re: Centurions / Newcastle Application for SL 2021 : Mon Dec 07, 2020 10:40 am  

You conveniently left out Toulouse.

As someone who claims to be subjective and moral compass of the forum, why the obvious bias.

Re: Centurions / Newcastle Application for SL 2021 : Mon Dec 07, 2020 11:37 am  

The Silent H wrote:

You conveniently left out Toulouse.

As someone who claims to be subjective and moral compass of the forum, why the obvious bias.

Read my post again, I said.............

with the Public Relations and aren't we blooming wonderful stuff taken out

Once I took the guff out about "Strong player development" "A beautiful stadium", "A major city" "A trip to be remembered in the pink city"......

I came to the "High quality stadium 18,784 capacity" and I thought what's the capacity do with anything when TO's two play off games only attracted a paltry 1,000 fans apiece?

Nothing in the application was of any possible real value to SL. Not just that stuff above, they don't have a TV deal, but they indicated would get on once in Superleague. I've heard that every year for years from them... Where is it?


.

Re: Centurions / Newcastle Application for SL 2021 : Mon Dec 07, 2020 11:56 am  

Donnyman wrote:

Read my post again, I said.............

with the Public Relations and aren't we blooming wonderful stuff taken out

Once I took the guff out about "Strong player development" "A beautiful stadium", "A major city" "A trip to be remembered in the pink city"......

.

In fairness, that is the extent of York’s bid too.

They’ve got a train station and a nice city for a day out. New fancy stadium of course but I don’t think that will be enough.

Re: Centurions / Newcastle Application for SL 2021 : Tue Dec 08, 2020 10:08 am  

Bulls4 wrote:

In fairness, that is the extent of York’s bid too. They’ve got a train station and a nice city for a day out. New fancy stadium of course but I don’t think that will be enough.

Yes of course.....York claimed to have 366 pubs, and I failed to see how that was at all relevant. I have this idea that even clubs like Workington have some wonderful local pubs. I know I'd love a train ride to York but have done that many times. A train ride up to the Cumbrian coast and some Cumbrian ale though would be fantastic. Town for Superleague

The Toulouse bid nearly sold me on a trip to the city, but I'd rather do Paris again despite having gone there several times. Not that I think we should bring Paris back....

The relevant parts of the Toulouse bid was the idea of a TV broadcast deal which of course is a REAL criteria for admitting overseas clubs to Superleague. When Toulouse first asked to come into Superleague Lenegan said they needed a paying TV deal and of course they and Catalans have strived over the years to secure such a paying deal to no avail.

That is a very big failing sadly.

The Toulouse bid did major heavily on the player production and grass roots work. That put Les Catalans to absolute shame. Schools, amateurs, women and wheelchair RL in numbers. But the problem there is despite having such a set up it doesn't translate into the production of SL quality players.

It may not even translate into the production of Championship level players, despite a fair old run in the English game dating back some years. At this point in they are a top championship club on the field. but this is achieved with 12 quality imports in the starting 17............

TO have to give it a go but for years ( since 2014) the summary of Ian Lenegan's view on their Superleague ambitions remains the same "Toulose need to back their application with the evidence of French players capable of playing at Superleague level , a viable financial plan and a television deal l

Sadly with a heavy heart they just do not do that. I find it very easy to love French Rugby League ....Very easy.....But I find it impossible to countenance the idea of a Catalans.v.Toulose derby in Superleague that doesn't bring in a centime of TV money and involves two Anglo-antipodeam sides with hardly a frenchman in sight.....

That's what Gausch has turned Catalans into that's what Toulouse would have to be.

Re: Centurions / Newcastle Application for SL 2021 : Tue Dec 08, 2020 4:55 pm  

Donnyman wrote:

TO have to give it a go but for years ( since 2014) the summary of Ian Lenegan's view on their Superleague ambitions remains the same "Toulose need to back their application with the evidence of French players capable of playing at Superleague level , a viable financial plan and a television deal l

Sadly with a heavy heart they just do not do that. I find it very easy to love French Rugby League ....Very easy.....But I find it impossible to countenance the idea of a Catalans.v.Toulose derby in Superleague that doesn't bring in a centime of TV money and involves two Anglo-antipodeam sides with hardly a frenchman in sight.....

That's what Gausch has turned Catalans into that's what Toulouse would have to be.

I thought Lenagan just dictated about stopping any money going to clubs outside Super League clubs.
Seems he now dictates how other clubs must conduct themselves.
Pleasing that he didn't instruct Toulouse to improve the French national side.

Re: Centurions / Newcastle Application for SL 2021 : Wed Dec 09, 2020 7:51 am  

Ornery Optimist wrote:

Lenagan didn't instruct Toulouse to improve the French national side.

He did......

Richard Lewis felt International RL was the way forward for the game hence Catalans were lifted into the Superleague in 2006 when they tried out a total of 21 French players in readiness for the return of the Great Britain.v.France test matches.

2007 saw that return at Headingley, that was a one sided affair with France eventually overwhelmed. Of course this was given time to build, a lot of time to build, and when Toulouse asked to come in to join Catalans Lenegan certainly told them they had to develop "capable" professional SL level French players. This was obviously in the hope two French clubs may have just underpinned at least a competetive French International test team.

But as we see now, both Les Catalans and Toulouse build their teams around a strong core of Antipodean and English players. 2006 is 14 years ago and in that 14 years the number of quality of French players has actually gone down Few are first picks for Superleague clubs.

So sadly these two iconic French clubs could only go forward in Superleague by fielding Anglo Aussie teams. But the second real problem is that neither provide any TV revenue let alone top players, yet quite a number of people keep blurting out "Toulouse" for the 2021 12th. place.

This phenomenon of people supporting clubs for inclusion in SL that have no value at all to Superlague (see Elstone's report) , has been evident since they felt Toronto Wolfpack was the future of the game back in 2016. Romanticism is fine by me, but we do need hard headed business decisions on these matters........

Re: Centurions / Newcastle Application for SL 2021 : Wed Dec 09, 2020 9:06 am  

Donnyman wrote:

He did......

Richard Lewis felt International RL was the way forward for the game hence Catalans were lifted into the Superleague in 2006 when they tried out a total of 21 French players in readiness for the return of the Great Britain.v.France test matches.

2007 saw that return at Headingley, that was a one sided affair with France eventually overwhelmed. Of course this was given time to build, a lot of time to build, and when Toulouse asked to come in to join Catalans Lenegan certainly told them they had to develop "capable" professional SL level French players. This was obviously in the hope two French clubs may have just underpinned at least a competetive French International test team.

But as we see now, both Les Catalans and Toulouse build their teams around a strong core of Antipodean and English players. 2006 is 14 years ago and in that 14 years the number of quality of French players has actually gone down Few are first picks for Superleague clubs.

So sadly these two iconic French clubs could only go forward in Superleague by fielding Anglo Aussie teams. But the second real problem is that neither provide any TV revenue let alone top players, yet quite a number of people keep blurting out "Toulouse" for the 2021 12th. place.

This phenomenon of people supporting clubs for inclusion in SL that have no value at all to Superlague (see Elstone's report) , has been evident since they felt Toronto Wolfpack was the future of the game back in 2016. Romanticism is fine by me, but we do need hard headed business decisions on these matters........

You say hard headed business decisions are needed, but you continue to champion Bradford as team 12.

A bit of a contradiction.

Re: Centurions / Newcastle Application for SL 2021 : Wed Dec 09, 2020 9:41 am  

The Silent H wrote:

You say hard headed business decisions are needed, but you continue to champion Bradford as team 12.

A bit of a contradiction.

Here are some crowds

Bradford.v.Leeds 24,020...............Touluse.v.York 650
Leeds,v,Bradford 21,666..............Touluse.v. Featherstone 1068
Saints.v.Bradford 15,042..............Toulouse.v. Hunslet 645
Bradford.v.Wigan 17,267.............. Touluse.v.Batley 868
Hull.v. Bradford 14,124.............. Toulose.v.Barrow 602........................................Bit of a difference