Re: Expansion done right : Tue Sep 06, 2016 5:12 pm  

wrencat1873 wrote:

I think that The Aussies are partly to blame on this.
Nothing happens on the International scene without their blessing and they always appear to put their domestic game above all else, which ultimately is not helping the game to grow elsewhere.
I agree about International fixtures in that they need to be given a higher priority. However, we are stuck with too few options, with only 3 top tier nations, plus 5/6 second tier teams and an improvement with France (a strong Toulouse club would help) is the first step in giving GB a meaningful mid season game.
Without them, we should be playing Aussie and NZ in alternate seasons.

While I agree the Aussies lack any real desire to play more international games, we can't blame it on the Aussies we don't play a mid season game against the French.

I would like to see two mid season breaks in super league. With the first break England playing France. Ireland, Scotland, Wales and Italy could also play.

The second Super league break I think we should play New Zealand down under when the NRL takes a week break for Origin and the pacific tests.

Along with the end of season four nations this would give England a decent number of fixtures. If they try play super league games at the same time as internationals, clubs will understandably put pressure on players not to play and the international game will continue to be undermined.

Re: Expansion done right : Tue Sep 06, 2016 6:13 pm  

Sir Kevin Sinfield wrote:

While I agree the Aussies lack any real desire to play more international games, we can't blame it on the Aussies we don't play a mid season game against the French.

I would like to see two mid season breaks in super league. With the first break England playing France. Ireland, Scotland, Wales and Italy could also play.

The second Super league break I think we should play New Zealand down under when the NRL takes a week break for Origin and the pacific tests.

Along with the end of season four nations this would give England a decent number of fixtures. If they try play super league games at the same time as internationals, clubs will understandably put pressure on players not to play and the international game will continue to be undermined.

As the no 1 RL playing nation, they should be driving the international program.

Whilst England playing against Scotland, Ireland and Wales sounds like a good idea, the reality is that, the other home nations are nowhere near SL standard and certainly a long way from being competitive against a full strength England team.
There would be benefit to the other nations but, England would potentially lose their edge if they play "easy" games.

Aussie prepare for their games by picking from the Origin stars and then playing the Kiwi's. Therefore we have to find a way of giving our players some serious competition and not just a glorified training session.

The only other way I can see is some kind of possibles vs probables but, there is very little commercial appeal to this so, it's a non runner.

Re: Expansion done right : Tue Sep 06, 2016 6:29 pm  

The area between Birmingham taking in Coventry down to north London with the Skolars occupied by our Championship 2 clubs needs to be encouraged and helped to eventually become our ' second front ' , we need junior clubs building within this area hopefully seeing one or two clubs moving forward into the Championship and potentially SL

Re: Expansion done right : Tue Sep 06, 2016 7:34 pm  

[quote="DGM"]Whilst we haven't seen a decent level of expansion at SL level, we have at grassroots. Junior & Open Age amateur clubs have sprung up all over the place in the past 10-15 years or so. Have a look on twitter, or on the RFL club locator and you'll be pleasantly surprised.

Is that really true?
I hope it is; my lad, who plays in the Pennine League, says there are 31 fewer teams this season than last. That's a huge loss.

Re: Expansion done right : Tue Sep 06, 2016 7:47 pm  

wrencat1873 wrote:

As the no 1 RL playing nation, they should be driving the international program.

Whilst England playing against Scotland, Ireland and Wales sounds like a good idea, the reality is that, the other home nations are nowhere near SL standard and certainly a long way from being competitive against a full strength England team.
There would be benefit to the other nations but, England would potentially lose their edge if they play "easy" games.

Aussie prepare for their games by picking from the Origin stars and then playing the Kiwi's. Therefore we have to find a way of giving our players some serious competition and not just a glorified training session.

The only other way I can see is some kind of possibles vs probables but, there is very little commercial appeal to this so, it's a non runner.

I didn't suggest England should play Scotland, Ireland or Wales.
I said England should play mid season games against France and then New Zealand. These are the best teams who are likley willing to play us. A stand alone mid season game against Austrailia is sadly a pipe dream.

Nobody would be interested in probables v possibles, I certainly wouldn't be buying a ticket and traveling to the game. Origin is unique to Austrailia and works for them, this is because RL is mostly played in 2 states, the Aussies are passionate about the state they come from so get behind their side and the players see it as a rep side. Like England and Wales both been part of the UK and people support them in sporting events. Sadly Wales aren't good enough to be competitive with England. It makes no sense to try and replicate something like origin where it doesn't exist.

Re: Expansion done right : Tue Sep 06, 2016 8:18 pm  

[quote="huddiepuddies"]

This is true for the Pennine League yes (I've played in it too for many years), but the main reason is that the Pennine league is still played in Winter. One of only a few that still is I believe.

My club have left it this season to focus on Summer leagues instead.

The main issues with Winter rugby is the training (you either need your own floodlights or have to pay decent £ for somewhere with floodlights), a massive amount of games get called off every season, the pitches are atrocious when you do manage to play and clubs struggle for players to commit, for most of the reasons above. Most of the clubs that have left are still going but in other setups.

Re: Expansion done right : Tue Sep 06, 2016 9:15 pm  

Australia has the money and media profile to push the international game forwards if it wants to. It was they who were the main culprits in the reduction in internationals and tours anyway with their NFL-like obsession with their own league.

I agree with that mentioned above about a mid-season international comp v France etc. I don't know about going down under for 1 game. I think that's a lot of expense for not much when we'll be more than likely be playing NZ at the end of the season anyway.

I get the point about France and the other nations not being up to standard but I think we have to start somewhere. And give France a dedicated, set in stone, international structure and I think they'll improve as will Wales.
It's getting a set calendar, year on year that is vital to getting the international teams to develop and improve.

I've said it before but I'd like to see a set international calendar of:
Year 1: 5 Nations alternating between here and down under. (Big 3 plus Wales & France when held here, top 2 Pacific nations when held down under)

Year 2: GB tour. Alternate between Australia and NZ. 3 match series.

Year 3: England Test Series. Alternate opponents between Australia and NZ. 3 match series

Year 4: World Cup

Plus an annual mid-season European Championship involving England, Wales, Scotland, Ireland and France. And ideally an annual mid-season Pacific Championship involving Australia, New Zealand, PNG, Samoa & Fiji.

I think that regular format would revolutionise international RL in both hemispheres. It'd show all those countries that we take internationals seriously.

Re: Expansion done right : Tue Sep 06, 2016 9:38 pm  

One thing that might get the Aussies more interested in Internationals is if we start beating them again. Hopefully that will start in November and they will sit up and take notice during the NZ -England final when they are confirmed the number 3 ranked nation in the World

Re: Expansion done right : Tue Sep 06, 2016 11:10 pm  

Biff Tannen wrote:

One thing that might get the Aussies more interested in Internationals is if we start beating them again. Hopefully that will start in November and they will sit up and take notice during the NZ -England final when they are confirmed the number 3 ranked nation in the World

Depends if the refs pull them out of the sh|t again like last time when exactly that should have happened.

Re: Expansion done right : Tue Sep 06, 2016 11:30 pm  

Him wrote:

Australia has the money and media profile to push the international game forwards if it wants to. It was they who were the main culprits in the reduction in internationals and tours anyway with their NFL-like obsession with their own league.

Historical revisionism at its finest.

We were responsible for the reduction in internationals and tours with the switch to summer seasons since 1996.

There hasn't been any proper international tours since.