Re: 'haven face a winding up order : Fri Sep 03, 2010 11:23 am  

LeighGionaire wrote:

I was a season ticket holder for 10 seasons running - went to lots of away games - bought a new top every season, RL Express every week and RLW Magazine every month etc, but as soon as they scrapped automatic promotion I gave up on the game.

I've only been to Leigh's new statium for one match (a spur of the moment thing just to see what it was like inside) and have now found other interests outside Rugby League to occupy my time.

Rugby League was the love of my life but the sport betrayed fans like me so I gave up on it.

Sadly you are not alone.

The club I have followed since I was 8 years old has "died" twice since this "great" system has been in force and the crowds have dwindled back to 3 figures.

They really have nothing to play for that would entice the crowds back.

But hey, it's not about the little clubs anymore. It's about giving overseas players a pension/holiday, short term thinking and about the colour of seat you want.

What happens on the field is secondary, and as for coaching/player development .

Yeh like England will definitely win the four nations/world cup/test series etc., etc..

Ah well it's the future and you are quite welcome to it.

Re: 'haven face a winding up order : Fri Sep 03, 2010 11:58 am  

Championship/NL1 average crowds:

2010 - 1,672
2009 - 1,784
2008 - 2,194
2007 - 2,082
2006 - 1,852

So the crowds rose, and then fell back again. There will be an effect from P&R going, but I would suggest the bigger effects have been the recession since SL crowds are falling too and so are footballs, and the fact that SL was increased to 14 teams for 2009 therefore taking away 2 of the top attended clubs from the Championship and lowering the average.

If we take out the figures for the clubs now in SL the averages are:
2010 - 1,672
2009 - 1,784
2008 - 1,969
2007 - 1,745
2006 - 1,681

So the Championship hit its peak in 2008, as I say the licensing system will have had an effect but also in 2009 the recession started to hit and both Salford (2nd highest crowd) and Celtic (5th highest) were taken into the expanded SL and replaced by Toulouse and Doncaster.

If SL were still at 12 teams the average Championship crowd probably wouldn't be much lower than before licensing, especially when taking into account the recession.

Re: 'haven face a winding up order : Fri Sep 03, 2010 12:06 pm  

OK, I don't understand. We supposedly are The Greatest Game. We are supposedly a fantastic sport to watch. We supposedly have great community spirit between our teams and their local communities.

But "fans" don't go watch their local team play this great sport simply because they don't like the system that moves clubs between leagues?
How about just being entertained by the spectacle of the sport?

Re: 'haven face a winding up order : Fri Sep 03, 2010 12:12 pm  

ExiledTiger wrote:

I have to admit I'm not a big follower of the lower leagues but when Cas were relegated the 'prize' was not winning a trophy but gaining promotion. I suspect at least part of the reason for dwindling crowds is that the ultimate goal of promotion to the top flight & watching your team play the big boys is now denied to clubs in the 2nd tier.
I'd be interested to know from fans of Championship clubs if this is the case or not.

1,500 at Leigh last night for what should have been our biggest match of the season

But being on TV and many floating fans losing interest for whatever reasons , be that some poor results on the pitch or the percieved lack of importance to the match led to a very poor turnout , and I can only see it getting worse from now on

Even to myself it was almost a ' relief ' that the season was over

Re: 'haven face a winding up order : Fri Sep 03, 2010 12:19 pm  

Lets all blame the recession, some people are really deluded if they think it is just the recession

Re: 'haven face a winding up order : Fri Sep 03, 2010 12:22 pm  

BigRob wrote:

Championship/NL1 average crowds:

2010 - 1,672
2009 - 1,784
2008 - 2,194
2007 - 2,082
2006 - 1,852

So the crowds rose, and then fell back again. There will be an effect from P&R going, but I would suggest the bigger effects have been the recession since SL crowds are falling too and so are footballs, and the fact that SL was increased to 14 teams for 2009 therefore taking away 2 of the top attended clubs from the Championship and lowering the average.

If we take out the figures for the clubs now in SL the averages are:
2010 - 1,672
2009 - 1,784
2008 - 1,969
2007 - 1,745
2006 - 1,681

So the Championship hit its peak in 2008, as I say the licensing system will have had an effect but also in 2009 the recession started to hit and both Salford (2nd highest crowd) and Celtic (5th highest) were taken into the expanded SL and replaced by Toulouse and Doncaster.

If SL were still at 12 teams the average Championship crowd probably wouldn't be much lower than before licensing, especially when taking into account the recession.

A lot of inflated attendances that year as certain clubs had to impress

At celtic when we visted they had 2 coach loads of german tourists in there on a freebie , not to mention an awful lot of service personnel , and a whole load of people who had been to watch the 2 previous matches , then left half way through our game

As for salford they had the 6,500 attendance against Swinton , an attendance they have not been able to match in SL since

Toulouse was supposed to make the Championship ' sexy ' , but that hasn't happened either

Leigh were supposed to get more fans because we have a shiny new stadium , that hasn't happened either

Shame really , the actual competition is very tight , but not enough seem to be too bothered

Re: 'haven face a winding up order : Fri Sep 03, 2010 12:29 pm  

Not forgetting the current economic climate- thats another reason to spread the game out of the North, no one has any money

Have a look at Skolars crowds they are sexy

Re: 'haven face a winding up order : Fri Sep 03, 2010 12:35 pm  

Richie wrote:

OK, I don't understand. We supposedly are The Greatest Game. We are supposedly a fantastic sport to watch. We supposedly have great community spirit between our teams and their local communities.

But "fans" don't go watch their local team play this great sport simply because they don't like the system that moves clubs between leagues?
How about just being entertained by the spectacle of the sport?

I'll reply with this post from waterfields finest on the Leigh board discussing the same subject at the moment

Agree with this general feeling. The game is dying slowly, though, not quickly.

I think Leigh will struggle to maintain four figure crowds by 2014, such is the lack of interest in a game and league with nowhere to go.

Last night, looking about me in the West Stand, I was one of the youngest members of the crowd I could see. There were very few people below the age of 30. The fan base at this level is literally dying off.

I've always maintained that monies should be distributed on a sliding scale according to where you finish in the league - whatever division.

It was never P&R that was the problem, just the utter financial cliff edge that was created between the leagues. If that cliff edge was smoothed out to just a financial steep hill then P&R would be the natural safety net that it always was and both leagues would benefit from the reinstatement of on-field interest (and therefore excitement) rather than us debating the results of the tri-annual powerpoint presentation competition.

I'd like to see the results of a survey on the actuall ages of the fan bases outside SL ?

I remember when Huddersfield came down in 2001 , we played them at the McAlpine [ as was ] I remarked at the time that there were very few children in the home crowd , and that we quite possibly outnumbered them

This is one of the reasons I dont want leigh to get a franchise , a potential 3 year holiday at the bottom of SL would kill a whole generation of support , were as 1 year in normal P and R would not

but hey ho , we have what we have , and what will be will be

Re: 'haven face a winding up order : Fri Sep 03, 2010 12:41 pm  

Starbug wrote:

I'll reply with this post from waterfields finest on the Leigh board discussing the same subject at the moment

I'd like to see the results of a survey on the actuall ages of the fan bases outside SL ?

I remember when Huddersfield came down in 2001 , we played them at the McAlpine [ as was ] I remarked at the time that there were very few children in the home crowd , and that we quite possibly outnumbered them

This is one of the reasons I dont want leigh to get a franchise , a potential 3 year holiday at the bottom of SL would kill a whole generation of support , were as 1 year in normal P and R would not

but hey ho , we have what we have , and what will be will be

The people of Leigh (not singling them out) don't seem interested in the spectacle of the sport now, would they really be any more interested just because the opposing teams changed?

Re: 'haven face a winding up order : Fri Sep 03, 2010 12:43 pm  

Richie wrote:

The people of Leigh (not singling them out) don't seem interested in the spectacle of the sport now, would they really be any more interested just because the opposing teams changed?

Probably not

Especially if they are Hunslet , York or Blackpool

Saints , Wigan and Wire might get them going a bit more