Re: England v Kiwis 3rd test : Sun Nov 11, 2018 7:28 pm  

wrencat1873 wrote:

You say nowhere near the quality of Oz and NZ but, we have just BEATEN NZ in a 3 test series or have you already forgotten the first 2 tests

The depth that he spoke about was more like a reference to the players that England were missing.
Widdop and Sam Burgess being significant absentees plus, Gale, Hall etc, etc and we still beat the Kiwis 2 -1

Exactly.
Utter nonsense to say we've no depth. We've been been hit really hard with injuries (especially in the play maker positions) yet won the series 2-1.

Re: England v Kiwis 3rd test : Sun Nov 11, 2018 7:28 pm  

Judder Man wrote:

Whats worrying is that half of this team won't be playing in the 2021 world cup and Bennett has not really brought any young players through.

Bennett doesn't really do that. You want Shaun Wane for that.

Judder Man wrote:

Bennett also talked last week about England having strength in depth but we are nowhere near the quality of Oz and NZ.

Rubbish, we have plenty more strength in depth than NZ (and Tonga, etc), but obviously less than Australia.

Re: England v Kiwis 3rd test : Sun Nov 11, 2018 7:29 pm  

wrencat1873 wrote:

Mind you, with the pack that we had,, the game was lost before a ball was kicked/passed and our second 40 was as bad as we've put in in a long time.

At the end of the first half and the first 10 mins of the 2nd half, Graham, Tom Burgess and Thompson were in the bench which left us with only Hill as a recognised prop on the field and a forward pack of Hill, Hodgson, Whitehead, Bateman, Greenwood, Milner. Individually some good ones in there but collectively that’s not suitable for international RL against a big physical NZ side and we conceded tries either side of half time that took any chance of staying in the game away from us.

Re: England v Kiwis 3rd test : Sun Nov 11, 2018 7:50 pm  

Judder Man wrote:

Whats worrying is that half of this team won't be playing in the 2021 world cup and Bennett has not really brought any young players through. Bennett also talked last week about England having strength in depth but we are nowhere near the quality of Oz and NZ.

Did he not send a full squad of young players to play in PNG.

You play your best players in a test series to try and win that test series, something Wayne Bennett has just achieved. You don’t pick players that you think could maybe be the best in 3 years time.

Re: England v Kiwis 3rd test : Sun Nov 11, 2018 7:51 pm  

wrencat1873 wrote:

Maybe we would but none of us will ever know

This was an ideal chance to blood a couple of new players and see if they really could make their mark at top International
level but Bennett chose not to go down that route.
.

To be honest the only ones he had left to pick were Percival, Lyne and Johnstone. As for the two centres, it’s not like Connor and Gildart have cemented their shirts and can afford to sit out the limited internationals we have. Percival has had a few goes and personally not sold on him as an international player and realistically Lyne is 5th choice at centre is Watkins was fit so again do you waste the chance to give today’s centre more international game time.

Could’ve put Johnstone in for McGillvary but given the lack of props then can see why he’d want McGillvary strength and carries. Blessing really for Johnstone that he didn’t play in that because he wouldn’t have been able to do much today given the difference between the teams.

Re: England v Kiwis 3rd test : Sun Nov 11, 2018 7:55 pm  

Judder Man wrote:

Whats worrying is that half of this team won't be playing in the 2021 world cup and Bennett has not really brought any young players through.

Why won’t half of this team be playing in 2021? Age wise a lot of young players in.

Re: England v Kiwis 3rd test : Sun Nov 11, 2018 7:59 pm  

ThePrinter wrote:

At the end of the first half and the first 10 mins of the 2nd half, Graham, Tom Burgess and Thompson were in the bench which left us with only Hill as a recognised prop on the field and a forward pack of Hill, Hodgson, Whitehead, Bateman, Greenwood, Milner. Individually some good ones in there but collectively that’s not suitable for international RL against a big physical NZ side and we conceded tries either side of half time that took any chance of staying in the game away from us.

The very fact that Milner is on your list says all we need to know.
He's a hell of a long way behind McShane at Cas and yet, deemed good enough for England ??

We were short on props before the kick off and badly exposed as the game went on.
We were found out on both flanks, especially McGillvery
, who just looked slow and nonathletic. He's great bringing the ball away from our line but as an attacking threat ??

Re: England v Kiwis 3rd test : Sun Nov 11, 2018 8:01 pm  

I thought they looked like a team who wanted to win but weren't all that bothered if they lost. Job was done before kick off.
A few questions need to be answered though. I agree that McGilvaray looked very sverage compared to the world cup. He came inside far too much for me.
Not sure the value of Lomax. Hodgson? I fail to see how he gets his place above Roby. Even Clark is better.
Would have preferred to see Ratchford get a run.
Overall I think Bennett now has a better understanding of the English based players, he now needs to blood a few more.
Finally its so good to see a Lions tour is set for next year(?).
Hopefully it will include club games too. We need a return to a 'proper' series.

Re: England v Kiwis 3rd test : Sun Nov 11, 2018 8:06 pm  

silver2 wrote:

One thing I've learnt from this series is to never criticise an English referee again. What they were allowed to get away with at the PTB was criminal.

Yep. That game demonstrated once again that Sutton is simply not fit to officiate at this level. Inconsistent with his decisions and missed (or ignored) a number of high shots and forward passes. The time allowed at the PTB was a shambles and some of the 'surrenders' he called (thus awarding the defenders several more seconds) were anything but.

And the first no-try should have been given. When the defender moves towards the dummy runner and makes contact that isn't obstruction; it's a bad decision by the defender. Very poor from Bentham. If that had been given we would have seen a different game.

But fair play to NZ, they showed their running flair at last. They hit form while we were off the pace. Not that it matters, the record books will show a 2-1 win for England.

Re: England v Kiwis 3rd test : Sun Nov 11, 2018 8:21 pm  

wrencat1873 wrote:

The very fact that Milner is on your list says all we need to know.
He's a hell of a long way behind McShane at Cas and yet, deemed good enough for England ??

Yeah I wasn’t convinced by Milner’s inclusion and given his limited minutes I’m not sure we’ll see him back in an England shirt unless significant injuries happen.

As for McShane he must just deem him behind Hodgson, Clark and Roby and thus not worth taking a look at going forward. Don’t necessarily agree as the squad balance we were left with this week suggested we should have had either another hooker or prop in it rather than a 4th centre in Percival/Lyne.....given that Ratchford could and did fill in there today then it was always pretty certain that at least one of those wouldn’t be needed. Whereas one hooker goes down in Clark and it left you a bit bare.