FORUMS FORUMS






RLFANS.COM
Celebrating
25 years service to
the Rugby League
Community!

   WWW.RLFANS.COM • View topic - The Academy: 2 decades of mediocrity
User avatar
RankPostsTeam
Player Coach13498
JoinedServiceReputation
Jun 25 200618 years11th
OnlineLast PostLast Page
28th Mar 24 23:5226th Mar 24 22:45LINK
Milestone Posts
10000
15000
Milestone Years
0510 1520 2530
Location
Forum21

Re: The Academy: 2 decades of mediocrity : Sun Mar 04, 2018 1:16 am  
lefty goldblatt wrote:
SC's list is a damping indictment if how far our scouting/development of youth has fallen, since it's 90's revamp. Those opening names still sit very well with me (bar Knott, never kicked on, for me).

Since then, only Wood, Riley, Penny and Currie are the only ones to come close. The rest (bar permacrock Rhys Evans....what might have been) are merely flotsam and jetsam or plain tosh.

So that's it. 10 players in 25 years. That's p155p00r by most standards, let alone a club who's youth policy is looked on with envious eyes.

With RU going pro 20+ years ago, top notch Aussies don't come here anymore, apart from idiots who can't behave themselves, and our underperforming youth policy, no wonder Moran's chequebook is regularly on his desk.


It would be quite telling to list the output of Wigan, Leeds and Saints during that 25 years by means of comparison.
lister 
User avatar
RankPostsTeam
International Board Member5888
JoinedServiceReputation
Dec 22 200122 years249th
OnlineLast PostLast Page
25th Mar 24 17:452nd Mar 24 09:02LINK
Milestone Posts
5000
10000
Milestone Years
0510 1520 2530
Location
Warrington
Signature
| Twitter | TopCashBack | Warrington Wolves Squadbuilder | Tata Consultancy Services

Re: The Academy: 2 decades of mediocrity : Sun Mar 04, 2018 7:17 am  
Here are just some of Wigan's.

Kris Radlinski, Simon Haughton, Sean Long, Andy Johnson, Darryl Cardiss, Paul Johnson, Rob Smyth, Jon Clarke, Lee Gilmour, Stephen Wild, Luke Robinson, Shaun Briscoe, Sean O'Loughlin, Kevin Brown, Gareth Hock, Harrison Hansen, Paul Prescott, Bryn Hargreaves, Darrell Goulding, Joel Tomkins, Mike McIlorum, Lee Mossop, Sam Tomkins, Josh Charnley, Liam Farrell, Stefan Marsh, Jack Hughes, Joe Mellor, Dom Crosby, Sam Powell, Matt Russell, Logan Tomkins, Joe Burgess, Ryan Hampshire, Dominic Manfredi, Lewis Tierney, George Williams, Ryan Sutton, Oliver Gildart, Tom Davies, Liam Marshall.
User avatar
RankPostsTeam
International Board Member651
JoinedServiceReputation
Dec 22 200122 yearsN/A
OnlineLast PostLast Page
23rd Mar 24 14:2529th Jan 22 16:36LINK
Milestone Posts
500
1000
Milestone Years
0510 1520 2530

Re: The Academy: 2 decades of mediocrity : Sun Mar 04, 2018 9:38 am  
Good discussion so far. There are lots of issues.
My observations are based on experience a while back so be out of date (I hope they are) but are that:-

Warrington sign players based very strongly on physique and fitness. If you are not going to be 6'3" and 15 stone they are not interested. Kyle Eastmond and Joe Mellor are two players who could have been at the club. Often they seem to sign players who are early maturers and have peaked already. Players are signed for achievement not potential. (Sam Tomkins at 15 had two Warrington based players ahead of him at county level but was still growing up - and maybe one day will ;) )

They don't build enough skills. Lots of weights. Lots of fitness. (Easy to coach) But no large scale skills development. Targets are set for fitness, body fat, weights lifted, miles run but not for skills

Academy games are seen as about winning rather than a chance to build your game and your skills. Players look no different at 18 than at 15 - same flaws, same qualities - maybe this flows through to first team too. I think players learn to hide weaknesses rather than correct them

Players are signed who (generally) want to play rugby - they then get to play no games for a year or two are excluded from playing amateur rugby or even 5 a side with their mates. If you have hopes of playing rugby and don't play, you fall out of love with the game. Most who don't get a contract at the end of their academy time never play rugby again. Most are not Warrington supporters now

The club behave as if they own the players. Social life scrutinised, Club activities take priority. You must train every week and extras are encouraged. And for £60 a week. With a 10% chance of success. Work a day a week at Tesco or an evening in a bar and the lifestyle is better.

Players from outside the area get better deals to attract them to Warrington. They are not necessarily better players but Warrington assume that locals will be loyal.

If/once you get to first team, no one pushes your development - you are there to do a job and you do it and you stay - you don't and you are out. Academy coaches have done their job and first team coaches have a product to fill a gap. There is little support for getting the player to a higher level.

Just a thought or two.....

M
User avatar
RankPostsTeam
Player Coach13498
JoinedServiceReputation
Jun 25 200618 years11th
OnlineLast PostLast Page
28th Mar 24 23:5226th Mar 24 22:45LINK
Milestone Posts
10000
15000
Milestone Years
0510 1520 2530
Location
Forum21

Re: The Academy: 2 decades of mediocrity : Sun Mar 04, 2018 12:12 pm  
Well the club must have identified this as a problem and recruited Peter Riding, from Castleford, as Head of Youth.

But I am confused with who is in charge of what here. https://warringtonwolves.com/performance-team/ We have a Head of Performance, then a Performance Manager. A head of youth, then 6 assistant u16 coaches. Jobs for the boys in 3 positions.

Please tell me it's not Gary Chambers and his dad teaching u16 back play.

The Wigan setup is very different with separate Performance and Rugby departments. They have Sean O'Loughlin (current international, club captain, multiple GF and CC, WCC winning club legend) working with the U19s.
Well the club must have identified this as a problem and recruited Peter Riding, from Castleford, as Head of Youth.

But I am confused with who is in charge of what here. https://warringtonwolves.com/performance-team/ We have a Head of Performance, then a Performance Manager. A head of youth, then 6 assistant u16 coaches. Jobs for the boys in 3 positions.

Please tell me it's not Gary Chambers and his dad teaching u16 back play.

The Wigan setup is very different with separate Performance and Rugby departments. They have Sean O'Loughlin (current international, club captain, multiple GF and CC, WCC winning club legend) working with the U19s.
User avatar
RankPostsTeam
Club Captain4422
JoinedServiceReputation
Jul 17 20159 years13th
OnlineLast PostLast Page
29th Mar 24 07:4928th Mar 24 14:44LINK
Milestone Posts
2500
5000
Milestone Years
0510 1520 2530
Location
Sitting on the naughty step
Signature
Just my opinions unless it's a FACT, in which case it's a fact.

Re: The Academy: 2 decades of mediocrity : Mon Mar 05, 2018 6:48 pm  
A real area of concern. Hopefully an area Price will be looking at.
Out of curiosity I wonder if young players look at that list and think they will have a better chance of being nurtured and developed elsewhere? Ben Currie being an exception.
User avatar
RankPostsTeam
Player Coach13498
JoinedServiceReputation
Jun 25 200618 years11th
OnlineLast PostLast Page
28th Mar 24 23:5226th Mar 24 22:45LINK
Milestone Posts
10000
15000
Milestone Years
0510 1520 2530
Location
Forum21

Re: The Academy: 2 decades of mediocrity : Mon Mar 05, 2018 7:26 pm  
Captain Hook wrote:
A real area of concern. Hopefully an area Price will be looking at.
Out of curiosity I wonder if young players look at that list and think they will have a better chance of being nurtured and developed elsewhere? Ben Currie being an exception.


Yes the young players must do that. If you had academy offers from Wigan, Salford and Warrington - where would you think you have the best opportunity to become a top player?
User avatar
RankPostsTeam
Club Captain4422
JoinedServiceReputation
Jul 17 20159 years13th
OnlineLast PostLast Page
29th Mar 24 07:4928th Mar 24 14:44LINK
Milestone Posts
2500
5000
Milestone Years
0510 1520 2530
Location
Sitting on the naughty step
Signature
Just my opinions unless it's a FACT, in which case it's a fact.

Re: The Academy: 2 decades of mediocrity : Mon Mar 05, 2018 9:06 pm  
What is Salfords record like? Ratchford? Myler?
User avatar
RankPostsTeam
Player Coach4197
JoinedServiceReputation
Jan 28 200717 years299th
OnlineLast PostLast Page
28th Mar 24 16:1128th Mar 24 16:11LINK
Milestone Posts
2500
5000
Milestone Years
0510 1520 2530
Location
The Nearest Faraway Place

Re: The Academy: 2 decades of mediocrity : Mon Mar 05, 2018 9:19 pm  
Captain Hook wrote:
What is Salfords record like? Ratchford? Myler?

Myler came from Widnes .... replace with Théo Fages, Jordan Turner & Marc Sneyd
User avatar
RankPostsTeam
Club Captain4422
JoinedServiceReputation
Jul 17 20159 years13th
OnlineLast PostLast Page
29th Mar 24 07:4928th Mar 24 14:44LINK
Milestone Posts
2500
5000
Milestone Years
0510 1520 2530
Location
Sitting on the naughty step
Signature
Just my opinions unless it's a FACT, in which case it's a fact.

Re: The Academy: 2 decades of mediocrity : Mon Mar 05, 2018 10:19 pm  
Builth Wells Wire wrote:
Myler came from Widnes .... replace with Théo Fages, Jordan Turner & Marc Sneyd

As soon as I posted it I realised there was only 1 place Myler could've come from!
RankPostsTeam
Moderator39305
JoinedServiceReputation
Mar 01 200222 years12th
OnlineLast PostLast Page
29th Mar 24 00:1628th Mar 24 16:22LINK
Milestone Posts
30000
40000
Milestone Years
0510 1520 2530
Moderator

Re: The Academy: 2 decades of mediocrity : Tue Mar 06, 2018 10:08 am  
Builth Wells Wire wrote:
Myler came from Widnes .... replace with Théo Fages, Jordan Turner & Marc Sneyd



niall evalds, the walne brothers.
PreviousNext

Who is online

Users browsing this forum: Big lads mate, Moe syslak, ratticusfinch, RoyalWire, St Helens Wolf and 263 guests

REPLY

Subject: 
Message:
   
Please note using apple style emoji's can result in posting failures.
Use the FULL EDITOR to better format content or upload images, be notified of replies etc...

Return to Warrington Wolves


RLFANS Recent Posts
FORUM
LAST
POST
TOPIC
POSTER
POSTS
2m
York - 14th April
Prince Buste
21
4m
BORED The Band Name Game
Boss Hog
56038
5m
Game - Song Titles
Wanderer
34318
6m
Rd 6 I Cas A
Exeter Rhino
130
13m
Huddersfield - Home
Deadcowboys1
9
29m
TV Games - Not Hull
Marcus's Bic
1389
34m
Ky Rodwell
FIL
112
39m
Cup Quarter Final TV Arrangements
WYSIWYG2
2
39m
No grade A for 2025 for Trinity
imwakefieldt
31
40m
21 man Squads - Devils v Leopards
WYSIWYG2
5
FORUM
LAST
VIEW
TOPIC
POSTER
POSTS
20s
York - 14th April
Prince Buste
21
28s
Game - Song Titles
Wanderer
34318
28s
Wigan/Saints
ratticusfinc
1
37s
Wigan v Sts discussion - THIS THREAD ONLY PLEASE
Jason65
1935
46s
TV Games - Not Hull
Marcus's Bic
1389
50s
This weeks disciplinary
rubber ducki
1008
1m
State of the Nation
UllFC
227
1m
Saints a
apollosghost
26
2m
21 man Squads - Devils v Leopards
WYSIWYG2
5
2m
No grade A for 2025 for Trinity
imwakefieldt
31
FORUM
NEW
TOPICS
TOPIC
POSTER
POSTS
TODAY
Wigan/Saints
ratticusfinc
1
TODAY
Another Tigers Defeat As Rhinos Go Level Top
RLFANS News
1
TODAY
York - 14th April
Prince Buste
21
TODAY
Stats article
Sir Gregory
5
TODAY
21 man Squads - Devils v Leopards
WYSIWYG2
5
TODAY
Squad for Catalan
rubber ducki
18
TODAY
The Wigan Way - New Podcast - Chairman Special
Jukesays
1
TODAY
Dons v Swinton Lions 30 June 2024
Wanderer
1
TODAY
Squad for Sheffield
AdamH
1
TODAY
London Away
Fartown58
1
TODAY
The Bulls away
Ckt2487
10
TODAY
The official Leon Hayes Thread
Smiffy27
18
TODAY
Saints a
apollosghost
26
TODAY
Leon Ruan signs on loan
Jemmo
2
TODAY
Wardle
Jo Jumbuck
3
TODAY
Huddersfield - Home
Deadcowboys1
9
TODAY
Max Wood on loan to Bradford 2 weeks
rubber ducki
7
TODAY
Jake Wardle 5 Year deal
Zig
22
TODAY
No grade A for 2025 for Trinity
imwakefieldt
31
TODAY
Cup Quarter Final TV Arrangements
RLFANS News
1
NEWS ITEMS
VIEWS
Another Tigers Defeat As Rhino..
166
Cup Quarter Final TV Arrangeme..
590
2024 Challenge Cup Quarter Fin..
707
Easy Does It For The Dragons A..
596
Warrington Demolish London For..
698
Leigh Leopards Beat Plucky Fea..
753
Saints Triumph Over Disappoint..
733
Easy Win for the Wolves Over L..
973
Dragons Condemn Castleford To ..
939
Leigh Leopards Secure First Po..
1086
St Helens Tame The Rhinos To W..
1054
Wigan Warriors Come From Behin..
1124
Betfred Championship and Leagu..
1097
2024 Challenge Cup Sixth Round..
3884
Featherstone Win Extra Time Cu..
1215
RLFANS Match Centre
Matches on TV
Table 'boards.stats_fixtures' doesn't exist