Re: Anyone believe we can come back? : Mon Jul 14, 2014 9:31 pm  

Not sure what games you are going too mate, I did 2 at the weekend u 17 skolars v Croydon, standard of kids rugby in the south has improved massively in the last 2 years btw.
Hemel on sat eastern region finals day, ok one game a bit one sided, the actual final was close run and a cracking game.
St Albans played the Army first team not so long back and gave em a good game, same Army team that played Chorley Panthers a heartland team, the standard was not that different.
Am RL is pretty healthy in London and the South

Re: Anyone believe we can come back? : Mon Jul 14, 2014 10:23 pm  

mickyb1234 wrote:

Not sure what games you are going too mate, I did 2 at the weekend u 17 skolars v Croydon, standard of kids rugby in the south has improved massively in the last 2 years btw.
Hemel on sat eastern region finals day, ok one game a bit one sided, the actual final was close run and a cracking game.
St Albans played the Army first team not so long back and gave em a good game, same Army team that played Chorley Panthers a heartland team, the standard was not that different.
Am RL is pretty healthy in London and the South

Michael. List the amateur Open Age teams in London and the SE with say a 5 year+ pedigree. Kids is all well and good, but the reality is that teams come and go with terrible frequency and are predominantly based arounf ex-pat northerners and Aussies.
I'd love to know how many of the kids that won at Wembley a couple of years back are still playing competitive RL?

Park RL is great.......but it doesn't deliver a pathway for professional athletes to progress in the game.

The Northerners have taken their ball home.......and the RFU didn't have to do anything to make it happen.

Re: Anyone believe we can come back? : Tue Jul 15, 2014 4:18 am  

I think we can, because we almost got there on our own before the SLE "franchise" nonsense. As London Crusaders we finished 4th, 5th and 3rd, just missing out on the big time, even when Brisbane first re-christened us we finished 4th.

That was despite a period of direct RL running of the club, financial squeezes on salaries, nomadism and no facilities etc etc et-al.

Don't get me wrong, I'm just as frustrated as anyone else that the "gift" of top flight footie was wasted, but reality is, it has been and we have to start again, right back from were we started.

Re: Anyone believe we can come back? : Tue Jul 15, 2014 9:26 am  

According to the handbook of the Southern Amateur Rugby League (as it was called then) for 1985/6 it's members were Aberavon, Bexley Heath, Cheltenham, Ealing, Fulham Amateurs, Fulham Travellers, Hemel Hempstead, Hounslow, London Colonials, Milton Keynes, Peckham, Peckham Pumas, Queen Mary College, St. Mary's College, Streatham Celtic, West London Institute, Wokingham and Oxford and Cambridge Universities. Obviously at this level clubs come and go (in Hemel's case to better things), but to lose all that is bizarre. No strong amateur base just makes our problems worse.

Re: Anyone believe we can come back? : Tue Jul 15, 2014 10:10 am  

Unfortunately most southern teams are based around one or two key individuals and rarely survive their departure. There are some very impressive exceptions but it's a legitimate question to ask what legacy, say, Crawley Jets left.

Sadly I'm hearing both Oxford and Hemel have dropped out of the U18 league this season. The former is particularly worrying as the whole ethos of the club is to build local participation and the first team this season have often included 14 southern based lads and I think it was 15 at least once. (Admittedly injuries have forced their hand a little here.)

Clearly the more juniors playing the more good players will be uncovered to play at the highest level available down south, currently Broncos.

As an aside, if the York press is, to be believed a RU player who made his debut for Oxford in Sunday had a rugby league background that amounted to four training sessions. Not exactly evidence of a sport thriving down south. (I should add a conversation I had with someone who is likely to know suggests he had been around the club long enough that he would have attended more than four training sessions.)

Re: Anyone believe we can come back? : Tue Jul 15, 2014 10:39 am  

On general survival think next year may be OK. I don't think the Hive will turn down the money until they can get rid of Underhill. The team my well be supported by the increased Sky money and parachute payments (both worryingly vague at the moment). So with 'free' ground and 'free' team don't see the urgent need to fold. ( I'm sure free can be defined by others)

Future years more worrying.

On a venue, London Welsh have signed up for a 3 year deal for the Kassam stadium in Oxford. This leaves them paying the Council for the Old Deer Park in Richmond. Advantages, Zone 4 underground/overground/fast trains, great club house and facilities. Disadvantage one poor 1,000 seater stand, but you can stand another 1,000 people round the outside of a rugby field do we need more?

Re: Anyone believe we can come back? : Tue Jul 15, 2014 11:15 am  

So many negative viewpoints on here and most of them sadly true. Re-entry into SL anytime soon looks no more than about a 5% or 10% chance.

And, even if we do, does the "club" have any prospect of being able to manage its affairs any more successfully than it has in recent years? Can't see how unless somebody new with commitment, bottomless pockets, and lots of savvy appears over the horizon. Chances of that? Almost nil.

Re: Anyone believe we can come back? : Tue Jul 15, 2014 11:57 am  

I agree with you GF their is no pathway for players into the top flight, thats why Tony Clubb is playing at Wigan, LMS at Saints, K Dixon probably soon to go to a SL team MCB just been picked up, where did they come from?

Re: Anyone believe we can come back? : Tue Jul 15, 2014 12:17 pm  

Louis is an example of how fragile the system is. From memory a cover teacher, who is an RL fan, suggested he tried it out. Had that teacher not gone to that school it is unlikely Louis would ever have played rugby. Tony meanwhile started RL a club who no longer exist.

It would be daft to say there is no pathway but the state of it is worryingly fragile. Throw in the fact the Broncos academy could be a target for the cut backs that will be necessary post relegation and it's difficult to feel optimistic unless the RFL get involved. We don't want to return to the days we had to loan Tony,Louis and Ade to Hull FC as we didn't have anything to offer down south at that stage in their development.

Re: Anyone believe we can come back? : Tue Jul 15, 2014 12:24 pm  

Yes we could, but the system is loaded against any team outside of Super League. We potentially have a one year advantage however it all depends on the recruitment and whether there is a balance there. It also depends on the coaching set up. I get the impression Grima is pretty much on his own at present and that won't really change until Henderson joins. It may be worth leaving judgement until we know what sort of squad we actually have. With a proper pre-season we should be in the middle 8.

The danger is as someone has said its a fresh group of our youth being bullied in the Championship rather than the current youth being bullied in the Super League.