Re: Forward watch : Sun Feb 13, 2022 3:15 am  

NickyKiss wrote:

It was a tight game with both defences on top. I wouldn’t get too eat up about the numbers from last night. To add context to the numbers, Morgan Knowles was absolutely superb on Thursday for my money. It was a supreme performance from him but statistically it doesn’t look all that. He made 20 tackles and ran for 69 metres. It looks poor but it clearly wasn’t.

I don't think the numbers necessarily tell the story either NK. One example I would give would be Mago's run and offload. He ran straight into the teeth of the defence so only made small yardage himself but his offload allowed the support player to make many more. His stats will show maybe 5 metres or so for that but the benefit to the team was far greater than his metres in isolation would show.

Re: Forward watch : Sun Feb 13, 2022 11:35 am  

Phuzzy wrote:

I don't think the numbers necessarily tell the story either NK. One example I would give would be Mago's run and offload. He ran straight into the teeth of the defence so only made small yardage himself but his offload allowed the support player to make many more. His stats will show maybe 5 metres or so for that but the benefit to the team was far greater than his metres in isolation would show.

I’m the worlds worst for looking at stats but the main stat from Friday was the scoreboard. We kept giving penalties away and that gave them repeat sets and limited how many times we then had the ball. I look at Byrne and 3 carries for 31 metres looks like he’s been taking it easy but I felt he carried the ball with real vigour when he did get the chance and the lad can’t do a great deal if we don’t have much of the ball when he’s on.

I’d have to watch it again because I was at the game and it’s not the best viewing ground but i wasn’t really worried about any of the middle forwards. There will be games where we dominate the ball more and the numbers will be better. We’ll probably lose some of those games as well.

Re: Forward watch : Sun Feb 13, 2022 2:26 pm  

I've just watched the recording
The stats don't really tell the true story though. Byrne played for 30 minutes (21 - 51 mins) and didn't come back for a 2nd spell. We scored three tries in that spell but played in the main without the ball due to conceding three penalties and making seven errors which meant we spent most of the time defending, hence the limited number of carries (it was actually four).

Re: Forward watch : Sun Feb 13, 2022 4:40 pm  

Just been looking at the team stats and the tackles, carries and overall metres made stood out.

Tackles

Wigan-327
HKR-281

Carries

Wigan-159
HKR-186

Metres

Wigan-1256
HKR-1171

It’s little wonder the forwards attacking stats aren’t jumping out when you’re having to make 46 more tackles and are 27 carries behind and that is all based around us giving away 10 penalties to their 5 and making 14 errors. It’s a credit to the lads when we did have the ball that we made more ground than them from far less possession (a couple of big breaks helped obviously).

I’ve seen a couple of comments around various boards saying Byrne’s stats were a disgrace but they really weren’t and the reasons are pointed out by Rogues above. I’m really excited about what he’ll bring this season.

Re: Forward watch : Sun Feb 13, 2022 4:59 pm  

NickyKiss wrote:

Just been looking at the team stats and the tackles, carries and overall metres made stood out.

Tackles

Wigan-327
HKR-281

Carries

Wigan-159
HKR-186

Metres

Wigan-1256
HKR-1171

It’s little wonder the forwards attacking stats aren’t jumping out when you’re having to make 46 more tackles and are 27 carries behind and that is all based around us giving away 10 penalties to their 5 and making 14 errors. It’s a credit to the lads when we did have the ball that we made more ground than them from far less possession (a couple of big breaks helped obviously).

I’ve seen a couple of comments around various boards saying Byrne’s stats were a disgrace but they really weren’t and the reasons are pointed out by Rogues above. I’m really excited about what he’ll bring this season.

Agree with this (and Rogues). It really wasn't a day where stats told the story and in all probability actually paint a false picture. Byrne's stats are a real case in point, not only for the reasons Rogues points out, but in that the metres made per carry showed how he was running the ball in. He really made good ground on every carry and they were not 'easy yards' either. I'd be willing to bet his post contact metres were excellent.

I think the thing to take our of Friday is that with good discipline, that victory (and therefore the stats we're commenting on) would have been far more comprehensive. That's where we need to focus our attention before next week. Judging by their game yesterday, Leeds will be a far tougher proposition and we can't afford to give them the easy possession that we gave Hull KR. If we do, you can guarantee they'll use it.

Re: Forward watch : Sun Feb 13, 2022 5:08 pm  

Our discipline has been poor in the Wire friendly and on Friday. Some of that I’m putting down to eager refs, who only seem capable of reffing one side but we also need to improve what we can control.

It’s a shame in some ways that Bentley will likely miss Friday with a ban, as he’d be good for a penalty or three. It’ll be a tough game. Leeds look strong and should’ve got home in that game yesterday, even with 12 men (and 11 for a spell). If we talk about our front rowers and what they did or didn’t Friday, we know one thing is for sure and that is that they’ll face a bigger test this week. There aren’t many better sets of middle forwards that Prior, Tetevano, Oledzki and Smith, so it’s a step up.

Re: Forward watch : Sun Feb 13, 2022 7:58 pm  

Stats tell part of a story but for example if you compare Bachelor to Batty they are more or less the same one gets MOM other he didn't do much. It was same last year regarding Knowels and Batty's stats wise.
Take Walmsley who has been easily the best prop maybe the most influential player out of the stats and most weeks it becomes more level.
I imagine Micky Mac's stats don't measure up well but the sum of what he brings are bigger than the parts, similar with Knowels.
Happy enough with the first outing from the pack lack of ball scoring twice on first tackle, and a lob sided penalty count ... The worse offence on Thornley wasn't penalized for example and so on.
Plenty to work on but I think we will.

Re: Forward watch : Mon Feb 14, 2022 12:13 pm  

NickyKiss wrote:

Just been looking at the team stats and the tackles, carries and overall metres made stood out.

Tackles

Wigan-327
HKR-281

Carries

Wigan-159
HKR-186

Metres

Wigan-1256
HKR-1171

It’s little wonder the forwards attacking stats aren’t jumping out when you’re having to make 46 more tackles and are 27 carries behind and that is all based around us giving away 10 penalties to their 5 and making 14 errors. It’s a credit to the lads when we did have the ball that we made more ground than them from far less possession (a couple of big breaks helped obviously).

I’ve seen a couple of comments around various boards saying Byrne’s stats were a disgrace but they really weren’t and the reasons are pointed out by Rogues above. I’m really excited about what he’ll bring this season.

When you look at the stats and I remember thinking at half time when the stats were shown, our stats looked like that of a team that should be losing, lower possesions rate, making more tackles and less carries would usually convert to a losing score yet we were comfartably in front and never really looked like going behind.
I never really like looking at the figures for forwards and how many use them to diss a forwards work rate, I have always said in the past, without further information like how many times we actually had possesion when a forward was on the field and from what field position we had possesion, you can't compare a forwards carries/meters made. If every set we had was off a long kick chase down field and therefore the outside backs were there to take the frist 2/3 carries then a foward may only take one drive in the set

Re: Forward watch : Mon Feb 14, 2022 12:40 pm  

Every prop should watch JWH play for Roosters as a benchmark to playing prop. He takes it in twice a set, makes well over 100m a game, boat load of tackles and brings the intimatory presence with him without punching folk.

Re: Forward watch : Mon Feb 14, 2022 1:48 pm  

post wrote:

Every prop should watch JWH play for Roosters as a benchmark to playing prop. He takes it in twice a set, makes well over 100m a game, boat load of tackles and brings the intimatory presence with him without punching folk.

Really? He's one of the dirtiest b******* in the game. He might not punch folk but he does everything else.

I'd take him in a heartbeat