Re: * * * Rumours & Signings XVI * * * : Tue Dec 29, 2009 8:25 pm  

jonh wrote:

Gasnier and Mateo in the backs, Luke Bailey in the forwards, Sl title won.

If the above are your INS who would your OUTS be?

Re: * * * Rumours & Signings XVI * * * : Tue Dec 29, 2009 8:27 pm  

MattyB wrote:

If the above are your INS who would your OUTS be?

This could be a long list......

Re: * * * Rumours & Signings XVI * * * : Tue Dec 29, 2009 8:55 pm  

Steinlager wrote:

There.

Where?

I still don't see where I'm criticising Wigan's recruitment policy as against defending Warrington's current attemnpts in that field.

Re: * * * Rumours & Signings XVI * * * : Tue Dec 29, 2009 9:18 pm  

Paul Youane wrote:

Where?

I still don't see where I'm criticising Wigan's recruitment policy as against defending Warrington's current attemnpts in that field.

No one cares, just go away and stop arguing.

Re: * * * Rumours & Signings XVI * * * : Tue Dec 29, 2009 9:32 pm  

Rogues Gallery wrote:

Paul, even for you that's a bit stupid.

Warrington have won two trophies at first team level in the last twenty years.
How many have they won at academy / reserve level in that time?

How many International players have they produced in that time that have come through their own youth system?

Do you think it gets anywhere near that of Wigan?

Hence why I entered this debate suggesting that Stinky Turner may not have been wise having a go at Wigan's academy. But at the same time the current Warrington set up is a long way removed from what it has been for many years.

To be honest winning trophies at reserve and academy level is missing the whole point of the exercise if those players don't go on to win trophies for that club. The last Warrington Academy team to be successful (and I think they might have lost the final to Wigan's in a curtain raiser to the Premiership Final between the same clubs at Old Trafford, although as I type I think Warrington may have won the Academy game) contained Sculthorpe and Harris and whilst they may have kept the club financially alive all the medals they subsequently won meant nothing to Warrington.

Its all well and good going on about the failings of Warrington's academy over the last ten years but in harsh terms of major trophies at first team level Wigan's has been such as un-successful.

Either way I'm pretty sure that over the next ten years Warrington's academy will produce it share of full level internationals even if at least three of them will be for Wales.

Re: * * * Rumours & Signings XVI * * * : Tue Dec 29, 2009 10:42 pm  

MattyB wrote:

If the above are your INS who would your OUTS be?

Fielden, Bailey, Carmont, Coley if necessary Hansen. Potentially also, one of Prescott and O'Carrol, Pryce, McIllorum.


Run up front with Bailey, Feka, Mossop, 1 of Prescott and O'Carroll, Davies as back up, Hock to offer support when his ban ends.

Mateo to play at 6 Tomkins to run at 7, TL at 9.

Gasnier to play wherever he likes!

Unsure of the quota status but from a financial point of view i think it could be possible, although Mateo would be the last on my list of targets should there be quota issues.

I fully expect Bailey to be in SL in 2011, but sadly Gasnier will go back to the NRL and Mateo will also probably remain in the NRL and who can blame them at the age they are at.

Re: * * * Rumours & Signings XVI * * * : Tue Dec 29, 2009 10:53 pm  

jonh wrote:

Fielden, Bailey, Carmont, Coley if necessary Hansen. Potentially also, one of Prescott and O'Carrol, Pryce, McIllorum.


Run up front with Bailey, Feka, Mossop, 1 of Prescott and O'Carroll, Davies as back up, Hock to offer support when his ban ends.

Mateo to play at 6 Tomkins to run at 7, TL at 9.

Gasnier to play wherever he likes!

Unsure of the quota status but from a financial point of view i think it could be possible, although Mateo would be the last on my list of targets should there be quota issues.

I fully expect Bailey to be in SL in 2011, but sadly Gasnier will go back to the NRL and Mateo will also probably remain in the NRL and who can blame them at the age they are at.

Cant see all them leaving, IMO for the 2011 season we will be signing a Fullback, Centre and Prop;

1.
2. Roberts
3. Gleeson
4.
5. Richards
6. Tomkins
7. Leuluai
8. Prescott
9. Riddell
10.
11. Hansen
12. Tomkins
13. O'Loughlin

14. McIlorum
15. Feka
16. O'Carroll
17. Mossop

IMO a few current players will surprise some people in 2010.

Re: * * * Rumours & Signings XVI * * * : Wed Dec 30, 2009 12:27 am  

Paul Youane wrote:

Hence why I entered this debate suggesting that Stinky Turner may not have been wise having a go at Wigan's academy. But at the same time the current Warrington set up is a long way removed from what it has been for many years.

To be honest winning trophies at reserve and academy level is missing the whole point of the exercise if those players don't go on to win trophies for that club. The last Warrington Academy team to be successful (and I think they might have lost the final to Wigan's in a curtain raiser to the Premiership Final between the same clubs at Old Trafford, although as I type I think Warrington may have won the Academy game) contained Sculthorpe and Harris and whilst they may have kept the club financially alive all the medals they subsequently won meant nothing to Warrington.

Its all well and good going on about the failings of Warrington's academy over the last ten years but in harsh terms of major trophies at first team level Wigan's has been such as un-successful.

Either way I'm pretty sure that over the next ten years Warrington's academy will produce it share of full level internationals even if at least three of them will be for Wales.

I agree that it matters not who wins what at Reserve and Academy level its a mute point.

The entire system should be aimed as providing clubs with quality players,the trophies at that level are a nice perk.

After that point I find it dificult to agree.

Producing Harris and Sculthorpe both players who have now retired is a shambles for a club like Warrington.

Secondally Wigan have not failed because of the Academy/Reserve products they have failed because they imported too many poor/average players.

Wales players are not full international players in real terms in the current game and will not be in the lifetime of the current Wire Academy lads.

I would also be interested to see you name the 7 players who you expect to kick on to be England Internationals.

Re: * * * Rumours & Signings XVI * * * : Wed Dec 30, 2009 10:14 am  

I don't want to look to far ahead really because we're a while off even starting 2010 yet without moving onto 2011 but the players i'd be targeting would include Moi Moi, Luke Bailey and Mcarthy-Scarsbrook at prop. After that it's really hard to judge what we'll need because we can't tell how certain players will devlope or how some of the more experienced guys will go on.

We may need a centre so guys like Inu and in a dream world Gasnier would be more then acceptable.

As I say though i'm more excited about 2010 tbh before thinking of who we may need in 2011.

Re: * * * Rumours & Signings XVI * * * : Wed Dec 30, 2009 12:32 pm  

jonh wrote:

Producing Harris and Sculthorpe both players who have now retired is a shambles for a club like Warrington.

Completely agree but the whole point I'm making is that is now history and Warrington are currently producing as many Academy players for their first team as Wigan currently are.

jonh wrote:

Wales players are not full international players in real terms in the current game and will not be in the lifetime of the current Wire Academy lads.

The thing is that in the current Academy at Warrington there are three true Welsh players who will play for Wales (two scouted in South Wales as schoolboys and moved to Warrington the other ex-Llanelli Scarlets). One of these is considered to be a "stand-out" player within his age group and is likely to play first team as a 17 year old this year at some stage for Warrington.

jonh wrote:

I would also be interested to see you name the 7 players who you expect to kick on to be England Internationals.

Not sure I mentioned 7 however to take this figure and deduct the three Welsh mentioned above then I would expect the following to have a good shout at making the grade at international level:

Ben Harrison; Mike Cooper; Ryan Shaw; and Kieth Holden and/or Liam Hulme.