Re: Hock : Tue Oct 30, 2012 6:43 pm  

But we are talking about the loss of players and potential players in this offseason and going forward, not last season.

[DaveO]

Re: Hock : Tue Oct 30, 2012 6:47 pm  

Rogues Gallery wrote:

What sort of fee do you think would be appropriate if Wigan do sell Hock.

Given he has four years left on his contract and his standing in the game at least the reported amount received for Joel T. That isn't the question that bothers me and I am not sure why you are interested in my valuation either. The question that bothers me is why, given the high esteem he is held as a player in the game why any offers of that ilk were not just declined. A players value is measured more than by just what you can sell him for IMO.

Maybe Wigan will have knocked any offers back and maybe this is all a twitter fuelled rumour that has got out of hand. What do you think?

Re: Hock : Tue Oct 30, 2012 6:52 pm  

I think part of the problem is a player having his head turned by a glamorous (NRL against SL) suitor. When a player is being approached it's bound to get them thinking. IF Hock goes it's more likely IL's cashing in on a player who doesn't want to stay and that makes sense (distasteful as it is for fans).

And yes, contracts mean jack when it's a buyers market.

Re: Hock : Tue Oct 30, 2012 6:57 pm  

WigansForeignLegion wrote:

I think part of the problem is a player having his head turned by a glamorous (NRL against SL) suitor. When a player is being approached it's bound to get them thinking. IF Hock goes it's more likely IL's cashing in on a player who doesn't want to stay and that makes sense (distasteful as it is for fans).

And yes, contracts mean jack when it's a buyers market.

Makes you wonder if IL had an inkling he would leave, and got the lengthy contract as a way of raising funds... shrewd if so...

[DaveO]

Re: Hock : Tue Oct 30, 2012 6:57 pm  

fatbaztod100 wrote:

Without a dead king the pretenders an't become the new kings. But knowing how some fans on here minds work, a few more scape goats is probably more accurate though.

I am not sure what scape goats has got to do with the issue of whether or not replacing the quality we have lost form the side is as easy and as matter of fact as you seem to think. I do not wish to be insulting or offensive but if you really think its as simple as you imply I think you are a bit deluded. I can't rememberer the last time we let so many experienced players go at once and replaced them with so many inexperienced or lesser players (and that applies whether Hock has gone or not). Yes in 10 years time it will all be history but its about what happens in the meantime as well - success or mediocrity.

[DaveO]

Re: Hock : Tue Oct 30, 2012 7:00 pm  

Wigan Peer wrote:

Makes you wonder if IL had an inkling he would leave, and got the lengthy contract as a way of raising funds... shrewd if so...

I don't know whether to laugh or cry. Has he got the lottery numbers for next week to hand while he is at it?

Re: Hock : Tue Oct 30, 2012 7:03 pm  

Sad to see him go if he leaves, we'll miss his impact, but we have plenty depth in the squad in terms a second rowers. At the end of the day, he's 29, he's hit his peak and for every good thing he does in attack, he generally does something equally stupid and he's one of our poorest defenders in terms of both effort and technique. They may not be as flashy, but I'd be content that a Hansen, Farrell and Lockers back three with Tuson, Hughes and Lloyd waiting in the wings will fill the gap adequately. Hughes and Lloyd in particular have massive potential improvements to come. As good as Hock is, the big trophies won in 2010 and 2011 were without him, so he is far from irreplaceable.

I'm far more concerned about the unproven halves, the depth in the centres and how reliant we'll be on Sam / how he'll be replaced in the long term.

Re: Hock : Tue Oct 30, 2012 7:04 pm  

DaveO wrote:

I am not sure what scape goats has got to do with the issue of whether or not replacing the quality we have lost form the side is as easy and as matter of fact as you seem to think. I do not wish to be insulting or offensive but if you really think its as simple as you imply I think you are a bit deluded. I can't rememberer the last time we let so many experienced players go at once and replaced them with so many inexperienced or lesser players (and that applies whether Hock has gone or not). Yes in 10 years time it will all be history but its about what happens in the meantime as well - success or mediocrity.

The year we lost Lam, O'Connor, Smith along with others springs to mind, and the repercussions were devastating to our team for several seasons that followed.

[DaveO]

Re: Hock : Tue Oct 30, 2012 7:07 pm  

WigansForeignLegion wrote:

I think part of the problem is a player having his head turned by a glamorous (NRL against SL) suitor. When a player is being approached it's bound to get them thinking. IF Hock goes it's more likely IL's cashing in on a player who doesn't want to stay and that makes sense (distasteful as it is for fans).

In which case as Hansen has reportedly been approached by Dean Bell why doesn't IL offer Hansen to the NZ Warriors now and get a fee rather than wait until his contract has expired next year and Wigan get nothing?

What about Mossop? He's on along term deal and rumours about him gong to the NRL have been knocking about. IL ought be able to raise a tidy sum for him as well.

Anyone else of interest to the NRL who we had better get shut of while we can make some money?

And yes, contracts mean jack when it's a buyers market.

Try telling Bradford that.

Re: Hock : Tue Oct 30, 2012 7:08 pm  

http://web.orange.co.uk/article/sports/parramatta_confirm_hock_talks Hock's England international colleague Lee Mossop believes the potential loss of his club team-mate to the NRL cannot be understated. "If he was to go, it would be massive," said Mossop. "You've seen what he's done this year. He's been outstanding for us in every single game. "I can't think of him having one bad game. Just his presence on the pitch is massive for us. He'd definitely be a loss not just to Wigan but to our game if that was to happen. "Obviously he made that mistake a few years ago but he's paid his dues. He's come back from his long ban and he's been outstanding. He's made up for lost time and won back the respect of his team-mates."

http://web.orange.co.uk/article/sports/parramatta_confirm_hock_talks Hock's England international colleague Lee Mossop believes the potential loss of his club team-mate to the NRL cannot be understated. "If he was to go, it would be massive," said Mossop. "You've seen what he's done this year. He's been outstanding for us in every single game. "I can't think of him having one bad game. Just his presence on the pitch is massive for us. He'd definitely be a loss not just to Wigan but to our game if that was to happen. "Obviously he made that mistake a few years ago but he's paid his dues. He's come back from his long ban and he's been outstanding. He's made up for lost time and won back the respect of his team-mates."