Re: HKR (CC) : Mon Jul 24, 2023 5:38 pm  

Trainman wrote:

Firstly congratulations to both Hull KR and Leigh, I hope they both make it a final to remember. It’s good for the game to see some new faces in the final and wish both team well.

There’s a lot of OTT reactions in this thread. Put Cooper and Havard in that team and it’s likely a very different outcome. I agree that props win pots and we were missing our best 2.

I think French is growing into the #6 role and has shown some very good touches. Assuming we continue and with a full pre season there I think he will be vastly improved next year.

Yesterday, in those conditions playing the second half with a player short was always going to be difficult. I don’t begrudge Hull KR the win but am left frustrated with a number of refereeing decisions at crucial times.

The sending off was a joke. Despite numerous replays there was no clear evidence he even made contact with the head, if he did it was secondary contact. The video was clear that initial contact was at shoulder level, Lewis’ head went forwards and then back. Direct contact with the head would have sent his head backwards initially. This is evidenced by the disciplinary report.

Yes, it’s disappointing to lose a semi final but there are still positives to be taken, if nothing else in terms of effort and commitment. I thought Ellis was very good, regularly got post contact metres. O’Neil is getting better as is Smithies who’s work rate was second to none again. The conditions didn’t allow either team to play expansive rugby. I think we were a little conservative at times. Where I would criticise Peet is not utilising Hill. With a man down the team we’re gassed, fresh legs could have made a difference.

Havard (if he can put a run of games together lately) and Cooper would have helped to a degree but I am not sure they would have made that much difference - we had no shortage of effort but it was creativity that was lacking, even with a full team on the pitch we didn't look like breaking Hull KR down and those two players would not have helped that. Smith is floundering at times because he is a young player trying to do everything, every 5th tackle play goes through him and it makes it easy for teams to read and in this game French was mostly non-existant - maybe next season he could get there but he is not helping the team structure as often he runs around in circles and stifles any momentum. The weather was the same for both teams (and KR had a few players missing too) and you can't always play on dry tracks- we just do not seem to be able to adapt well enough.

Re: HKR (CC) : Mon Jul 24, 2023 5:42 pm  

Keiththered wrote:

Other ex referees have a different view

They do mate that is what rugby is all about. There is certainly no question that it was a debatable and game changing decision. HKR may still have won, who knows.

Personally, I thought it was a poor decision. It is a tackle we witness on a regular basis. If you take the aggression out of rugby league we have no game and there were certainly mitigating circumstances. The problem we have is that people who have never played the game are making crucial decisions and getting them wrong. Shorrocks got sent off and got a one game ban and yet Matautia got sin binned and received a two game ban, how do you explain that? I think it is time we had an ex-player helping the video referee.

Re: HKR (CC) : Mon Jul 24, 2023 5:44 pm  

exiled Warrior wrote:

Havard (if he can put a run of games together lately) and Cooper would have helped to a degree but I am not sure they would have made that much difference - we had no shortage of effort but it was creativity that was lacking, even with a full team on the pitch we didn't look like breaking Hull KR down and those two players would not have helped that. Smith is floundering at times because he is a young player trying to do everything, every 5th tackle play goes through him and it makes it easy for teams to read and in this game French was mostly non-existant - maybe next season he could get there but he is not helping the team structure as often he runs around in circles and stiffles any momentum. The weather was the same for both teams (and KR had a few players missing too) and you can't always play on dry tracks- we just do not seem to be able to adapt well enough.

We need a genuine stand off, we should not be experimenting.

Re: HKR (CC) : Mon Jul 24, 2023 6:41 pm  

Zig wrote:

We need a genuine stand off, we should not be experimenting.

We need a Trent Barrett. Sadly, thats most unlikely these days

Re: HKR (CC) : Mon Jul 24, 2023 6:49 pm  

[quote="Trainman"]Firstly congratulations to both Hull KR and Leigh, I hope they both make it a final to remember. It’s good for the game to see some new faces in the final and wish both team well.

There’s a lot of OTT reactions in this thread. Put Cooper and Havard in that team and it’s likely a very different outcome. I agree that props win pots and we were missing our best 2.

I think French is growing into the #6 role and has shown some very good touches. Assuming we continue and with a full pre season there I think he will be vastly improved next year.

Yesterday, in those conditions playing the second half with a player short was always going to be difficult. I don’t begrudge Hull KR the win but am left frustrated with a number of refereeing decisions at crucial times.

The sending off was a joke. Despite numerous replays there was no clear evidence he even made contact with the head, if he did it was secondary contact. The video was clear that initial contact was at shoulder level, Lewis’ head went forwards and then back. Direct contact with the head would have sent his head backwards initially. This is evidenced by the disciplinary report.

Yes, it’s disappointing to lose a semi final but there are still positives to be taken, if nothing else in terms of effort and commitment. I thought Ellis was very good, regularly got post contact metres. O’Neil is getting better as is Smithies who’s work rate was second to none again. The conditions didn’t allow either team to play expansive rugby. I think we were a little conservative at times. Where I would criticise Peet is not utilising Hill. With a man down the team we’re gassed, fresh legs could have made a difference.[/quote]

I'm sick of picking the positives from defeat in crucial games, sick of heading in the right direction without ever getting there. We were again clueless with ball in hand, even befoe Shorrocks went off. Let's not be kidded into believing HKR are a great side, they aren't, yet they've beaten us 3 times - which makes us even less of a great side.

Peet has been in charge now for 18 months, his team, his core, his spine. Forget Rads, Peet has the talent in that team to be performing far better than we are with far better results.

Re: HKR (CC) : Mon Jul 24, 2023 7:20 pm  

How many big games have we lost under Peet? Two semi finals?

That would be a poor record if we hadn't also won one semi final and a final.

So a 50/50 record.

Re: HKR (CC) : Mon Jul 24, 2023 7:28 pm  

Egg Chasing wrote:

How many big games have we lost under Peet? Two semi finals?

That would be a poor record if we hadn't also won one semi final and a final.

So a 50/50 record.

Ah statistics.
One semi final win out of three.
So a 33.3% success rate.

I don’t think that we are a bad team I just think we’ve an unbalanced squad with a severe lack of experience.

Re: HKR (CC) : Mon Jul 24, 2023 7:33 pm  

Itchy Arsenal wrote:

I don’t think that we are a bad team I just think we’ve an unbalanced squad with a severe lack of experience.

Quite possibly. Perhaps they'll learn from yesterday and manage things differently in the next one they play in. That's what will define how good a coach Peet is.

We're hardly heading in the right direction without ever getting there as someone said. We won the f***** thing last year.

Re: HKR (CC) : Mon Jul 24, 2023 7:34 pm  

[quote="Egg Chasing"]How many big games have we lost under Peet? Two semi finals?

That would be a poor record if we hadn't also won one semi final and a final.

So a 50/50 record.[/quote]

I wish my view of success, progression and what constitutes good rugby and good management were as low as yours, I really do. It's not the losses, it's the manner in which we've lost and seeing it repeated. You cling to the positives from defeat that you seem happy with, I'll continue to hope for better

Re: HKR (CC) : Mon Jul 24, 2023 7:46 pm  

Egg Chasing wrote:

Quite possibly. Perhaps they'll learn from yesterday and manage things differently in the next one they play in. That's what will define how good a coach Peet is.

We're hardly heading in the right direction without ever getting there as someone said. We won the f***** thing last year.

Yeah that could be an outcome but we’ve only Havard to come back so Peet and his team will have to do it effectively with the same team. As a minimum I think Peet will be pressed to trust his youngsters more.

I don’t think that we are good enough to turn it around. As I keep saying hopefully I’m proven to be wrong.
If I’m honest I’m more concerned about next year. For me none of the forwards signed go anywhere near resolving the issues in the pack and the lack of a decent 6 still remains.