[Wigan6/Leeds1 Andy]

Re: Maguire to see out contract : Mon Feb 07, 2011 1:27 pm  

Wandering Warrior wrote:

Wishful thinking if ever ive seen it. I think our revival is really hurting you

Wouldn't you be hurting if Brian McDermott was the saviour of your team?

Re: Maguire to see out contract : Mon Feb 07, 2011 1:33 pm  

DaveO wrote:

If you look for the empirical evidence of what coaches actually do you will find the vast majority fulfil their contracts for the full term unless sacked. Rarely do they leave early.

I guess that the empirical evidence would also suggest that the vast majority of those who fulfil their contracts for the full term or are sacked don't go back to the NRL as a head coach?

The point is that very few NRL teams want a SL coach; I think that is different with MM (or it should be!). I think it's perfectly reasonable to assume that he would want to leave if offered a head coach role in the NRL. Let's be honest, he is only here as a stepping stone to that goal - wouldn't you agree?

I think people are getting way too defensive about a fairly reasonable point made, just because it was made by a Leeds fan.

[DaveO]

Re: Maguire to see out contract : Mon Feb 07, 2011 2:35 pm  

FearTheVee wrote:

I guess that the empirical evidence would also suggest that the vast majority of those who fulfil their contracts for the full term or are sacked don't go back to the NRL as a head coach?

Several coaches have done so in the past such as Lowe, Monie, Brian Smith. Raper did and I am sure one of Leeds recent coaches did. So I don't think you are correct there. In any case what that has got to do with a coach leaving early I do not know unless you are trying to suggest that any Oz coach over here who enjoys any success ought to leave ASAP while his star is shining brightly but if you are there is no evidence that works either.

The point is that very few NRL teams want a SL coach; I think that is different with MM (or it should be!). I think it's perfectly reasonable to assume that he would want to leave if offered a head coach role in the NRL. Let's be honest, he is only here as a stepping stone to that goal - wouldn't you agree?

And that stepping stone is doing a three year apprenticeship here. I see no reason to doubt the man's word. There is no hint he or his family are unhappy here. He is a young coach and time is on his side so he has no need to rush back at the first sniff of an NRL position.

I think people are getting way too defensive about a fairly reasonable point made, just because it was made by a Leeds fan.

The point being made was one dimensional that if the NRL calls the coach would run and no other considerations matter. It's the same with players. I'd expect a few more to go over there over the next few years as we don't increase the salary cap and inflation reduces the players wages even more but I also know not everyone wants to go and live in Oz even if they have an offer to play in the NRL. The bottom line is it is simplistic not to consider all the factors when someone makes a decision to leave a club early.

Re: Maguire to see out contract : Mon Feb 07, 2011 2:40 pm  

FearTheVee wrote:

I guess that the empirical evidence would also suggest that the vast majority of those who fulfil their contracts for the full term or are sacked don't go back to the NRL as a head coach?

The point is that very few NRL teams want a SL coach; I think that is different with MM (or it should be!). I think it's perfectly reasonable to assume that he would want to leave if offered a head coach role in the NRL. Let's be honest, he is only here as a stepping stone to that goal - wouldn't you agree?

I think people are getting way too defensive about a fairly reasonable point made, just because it was made by a Leeds fan.

It is reasonable to asume that at some point Maguire will return to the nrl. Though the argument at present is that previous posters on this thread state that if Maguire is offered an nrl deal now then he will just walk away from his contract, and also state that as fact. Yes, it is possible, but myself, like others on here dont think that will happen

Re: Maguire to see out contract : Mon Feb 07, 2011 2:42 pm  

FearTheVee wrote:

I guess that the empirical evidence would also suggest that the vast majority of those who fulfil their contracts for the full term or are sacked don't go back to the NRL as a head coach?

The point is that very few NRL teams want a SL coach; I think that is different with MM (or it should be!). I think it's perfectly reasonable to assume that he would want to leave if offered a head coach role in the NRL. Let's be honest, he is only here as a stepping stone to that goal - wouldn't you agree?

I think people are getting way too defensive about a fairly reasonable point made, just because it was made by a Leeds fan.

Not at all.

His original point was and I Quote

sgtwilko wrote:

if an nrl club come in with a concrete offer maguire is gone. dont kid yourselves.

Followed by

sgtwilko wrote:

what a load of rubbish. the only thing i have a problem with wigan is how deluded a lot of you lot are.

im straight down the line and i will stick to my guns on it. how you lot have acted from this time last year till know is laughable. massive U-turn alert

i couldnt give a rats ar$e if you read, listen or acknowlege my opinion. if anyone thinks madge would turn an nrl head coach job down to stay at wigan they are mad, deluded or mad and deluded

Followed By

sgtwilko wrote:

you are correct i am speculating.

Now that's quite a U-Turn in my book?

Now as far as I can see, A Leeds fan says MM Will be off like a shot if he gets a Contract offer from an NRL club? Yes or No?
How do we know he hasn't had 1 already? How do we know he will take up said offer hypothetically if Hypothetically he got an offer in the future before, and this is the important word, BEFORE his current contract is up at Wigan?

Show me 1 Wigan fan that says he definately Won't go? You can't because they haven't!
On the other hand we have someone who has stated that he will definately go and we are Deluded & Mad if we don't believe him even though in his own words he is "Speculating"!

Why didn't Anderson go after his first full season with Saints after he'd done the double? Did he get an offer? If he did why didn't he go? If he didn't why not, he won more than Maguire!

End of the day, no-one knows what MM would/wouldn't do. All I would say is that I wouldn't think he woul"Automatically" go if he got an offer and certainly if it wasn't from one of the Big Boys in the NRL.
If he did get the Big offer he may very well go, but I certainly don't consider having the thought that he most probably, until we get some evidence either way, to be Mad or delusional!

The rest of SL can just sit and wait in the Hope that we are delusional!

Personally I think they'd be better, Leeds especially, worrying about their own issues than worrying about ours!

Re: Maguire to see out contract : Mon Feb 07, 2011 2:45 pm  

DaveO wrote:

Several coaches have done so in the past such as Lowe, Monie, Brian Smith. Raper did and I am sure one of Leeds recent coaches did.

Like I said, the vast majority don't. You're going back a fair old time there!

DaveO wrote:

There is no hint he or his family are unhappy here. He is a young coach and time is on his side so he has no need to rush back at the first sniff of an NRL position.

NRL head coach position's don't come up that often and are usually pretty keenly contested; if one came up and MM was offered it, I have little doubt he would take it. The longer you are out of the NRL, the further you fall behind the cutting edge of the sport. It's why NRL coaches coming in tend to make such disproportional improvements in teams - they bring all the newest developments over with them. If they stay in SL too long, they lose out.

I know you don't agree, but hey that's what opinions are for.

Re: Maguire to see out contract : Mon Feb 07, 2011 2:51 pm  

Daniel Anderson, McRae?

Re: Maguire to see out contract : Mon Feb 07, 2011 2:57 pm  

Rogues Gallery wrote:

Daniel Anderson, McRae?

Are very good examples of coaches who moved to SL with latest NRL ideas and had huge impacts (see MM) but stayed in SL for too long; Anderson sacked and McRae replaced with a 25% win ratio.

It's easy enough to reel off a couple of names who went back to head coach jobs, but why not list all the overseas coaches since McCrae arrived and we can see how many went back to head coach posts? I'd venture the vast majority didn't (which, after all, was my point).

Re: Maguire to see out contract : Tue Feb 08, 2011 1:25 pm  

Wandering Warrior wrote:

Wishful thinking if ever ive seen it. I think our revival is really hurting you

It's not hurting me at all. I love rugby league but I don't lose any sleep about who wins the trophies. Im pi$$ed of for a few days maybe a week tops after a big lose like the 05 gf but there are far bigger things in life.

I just made just expressed my opinion.

Re: Maguire to see out contract : Tue Feb 08, 2011 1:42 pm  

Jukesays wrote:

Not at all.

His original point was and I Quote

Followed by

Followed By

Now that's quite a U-Turn in my book?

Now as far as I can see, A Leeds fan says MM Will be off like a shot if he gets a Contract offer from an NRL club? Yes or No?
How do we know he hasn't had 1 already? How do we know he will take up said offer hypothetically if Hypothetically he got an offer in the future before, and this is the important word, BEFORE his current contract is up at Wigan?

Show me 1 Wigan fan that says he definately Won't go? You can't because they haven't!
On the other hand we have someone who has stated that he will definately go and we are Deluded & Mad if we don't believe him even though in his own words he is "Speculating"!

Why didn't Anderson go after his first full season with Saints after he'd done the double? Did he get an offer? If he did why didn't he go? If he didn't why not, he won more than Maguire!

End of the day, no-one knows what MM would/wouldn't do. All I would say is that I wouldn't think he woul"Automatically" go if he got an offer and certainly if it wasn't from one of the Big Boys in the NRL.
If he did get the Big offer he may very well go, but I certainly don't consider having the thought that he most probably, until we get some evidence either way, to be Mad or delusional!

The rest of SL can just sit and wait in the Hope that we are delusional!

Personally I think they'd be better, Leeds especially, worrying about their own issues than worrying about ours!

No u-turn at all. Just the same thing I've always said. It's my opinion but I think its a fair point. You just dont like it so want to twist it.it's what you always do when you write a novel of a post.

Of course it's speculation, I'm speculating that a coach would take an nrl job over an sl job? Which bit of that have you a problem with! Basically you get all defensive because it's your coach. I would say the same for any sl coach, browny is another one who would going a concrete offer was on the table. But when I offer up an opinion the replies don't discuss the issue they are full of deflections, its because I'm a Leeds fan? Or im envious? I've seen Leeds win 4 titles 3 in a row I have nothing to be bitter about I watched Leeds for long enough win nowt. If they win nowt again al die a happy man. Win or lose I don't love em anymore or any less.