Re: Hansen signs for Salford - official : Wed Dec 18, 2013 12:06 pm  

H did not want to leave Wigan.
Wane really did not want him to go.
Rads really did not want him to go.
The team really did not want him to go.
The fans did not want him to go (and H knows this)

Lenagan should not mistake loyalty for stupidity, Wane wanted to offer the money, Lenagan did not, simple.

H has a family and a future to look at after Rugby League and has made a very smart move in my opinion, but I can assure you he is gutted he's leaving. The contract Wigan offered was nothing short of disgusting.

Re: Hansen signs for Salford - official : Wed Dec 18, 2013 12:08 pm  

I think it will be interesting to see if peoples views change once they have seen Hopkins and Clubb perform for Wigan.

Hopkins in particular would clearly of been snapped up by other clubs had Wigan not offered him a very good deal in comparison and from what people who have seen him play regularly say he has a very bright future in the game and Wigan have made a great signing.

Having said this I think Hansen is a great signing for Salford and gives their ambition a lot of credibility.

Can't wait for Wigan V Salford - usually a fixture that would raise few eyebrows.

Re: Hansen signs for Salford - official : Wed Dec 18, 2013 12:42 pm  

Binosh wrote:

H did not want to leave Wigan.
Wane really did not want him to go.
Rads really did not want him to go.
The team really did not want him to go.
The fans did not want him to go (and H knows this)

Lenagan should not mistake loyalty for stupidity, Wane wanted to offer the money, Lenagan did not, simple.

H has a family and a future to look at after Rugby League and has made a very smart move in my opinion, but I can assure you he is gutted he's leaving. The contract Wigan offered was nothing short of disgusting.

Unfortunately we've only got your word for that.

There's nothing personal intended here, but if some people aren't prepared to believe IL, why should others believe you?

Re: Hansen signs for Salford - official : Wed Dec 18, 2013 12:46 pm  

WARRIORCRAIG wrote:

So you believe HH 100% because on Wigan TV he said that he would stay here for as long as Wigan wanted him, but IL saying he wanted to leave is PR spin? He was offerred a long-term deal at Wigan and turned it down, he was going to leave at the end of 2014 anyway for free even if IL turned down the transfer fee and made him stay. He's left for more money, that's the bottom line. Koucash has clearly made him an offer which means even a WCC is Oz and a testimonial isn't a big enough draw to stay on for one more season, and Wigan have benefitted financially by getting a large transfer fee for a player who would have left for free in a year's time anyway. You're just, once again, trying to spin a story so you can use it as a stick to beat IL with.

i think we are all used to DaveO's posts by now

Re: Hansen signs for Salford - official : Wed Dec 18, 2013 12:59 pm  

pie.warrior wrote:

PS ( who has the crystal ball that was used when they let Fielden go...)

you didn't exactly need a crystal ball for that one.....

Re: Hansen signs for Salford - official : Wed Dec 18, 2013 1:56 pm  

Cruncher wrote:

Unfortunately we've only got your word for that.

There's nothing personal intended here, but if some people aren't prepared to believe IL, why should others believe you?

Nothing personal taken, people can choose to believe whatever they want, but H is a mate and I don't like seeing the personal insults on here and Facebook that his family can see when he put himself on the line for Wigan for 10 years.

Rugby at the top level is a short tenure that could end tomorrow and in my opinion made the right decision.

[DaveO]

Re: Hansen signs for Salford - official : Wed Dec 18, 2013 4:28 pm  

Cruncher wrote:

While I agree with you in spirit, the bit I've underlined is really no more than an assumption designed to suit your argument.

In other words, the club is lying.

How do we know that?

Hang on. When I have quoted the clubs statements in the past I am told not to believe everything I read (and I am pretty certain by yourself amongst others).

When I now treat this one with such scepticism I am accusing them of lying?

Sorry but you can't have it both ways and you are even doing it yourself here by suggesting I should not believe H's Wigan TV interview but should believe this press release?

Also, remember that players do PR as well. Hansen told Wigan fans he wanted to stay. Of course he'd say that. But he'd likely say exactly the opposite to the Salford lot ... especially if he learned their valuation of his services was higher than Wigan's.

At the end of the day, his burning desire will be to go where he can earn most money, which would appear to be Salford. I'm not at all happy about that - I consider this a bad loss and I'm disappointed, but we can't just assume - as people on the other site have - that Hansen was the personification of loyalty and desperately wanted to stay.

I don't think they are assuming loyalty particularly in Josie's case but a desire not to move in the first place. And as to players doing PR, I agree and H isn't likely to say anything negative about joining Salford now he has for this reason. Now the deal is done he may well be settled in his own mind this is a good thing and has bought into it but that doesn't mean that was his starting position.

I agree with you about this being a bad loss and that it is about money. Why we were not prepared to match Salford I have no idea given the dearth of players of H's standard. My view is as H said on Wigan TV, he would stay here as long as he was wanted and I don't think he had to qualify that by saying "but not on a poor wage compared to elsewhere" which you take as read.

I believe had we offered as much he'd still be here so any talk of loyalty to us or desire to play for Salford are both equally spurious issues. It's about money and IL wasn't preprepared to spend it IMO. A mistake I feel.

Re: Hansen signs for Salford - official : Wed Dec 18, 2013 6:14 pm  

DaveO wrote:

Hang on. When I have quoted the clubs statements in the past I am told not to believe everything I read (and I am pretty certain by yourself amongst others).

When I now treat this one with such scepticism I am accusing them of lying?

Sorry but you can't have it both ways and you are even doing it yourself here by suggesting I should not believe H's Wigan TV interview but should believe this press release?

I don't think they are assuming loyalty particularly in Josie's case but a desire not to move in the first place. And as to players doing PR, I agree and H isn't likely to say anything negative about joining Salford now he has for this reason. Now the deal is done he may well be settled in his own mind this is a good thing and has bought into it but that doesn't mean that was his starting position.

I agree with you about this being a bad loss and that it is about money. Why we were not prepared to match Salford I have no idea given the dearth of players of H's standard. My view is as H said on Wigan TV, he would stay here as long as he was wanted and I don't think he had to qualify that by saying "but not on a poor wage compared to elsewhere" which you take as read.

I believe had we offered as much he'd still be here so any talk of loyalty to us or desire to play for Salford are both equally spurious issues. It's about money and IL wasn't preprepared to spend it IMO. A mistake I feel.

But we have a salary cap at the end of the day. Salford don't have any players the calibre of Bowen, Charnley or Lockers to pay and don't have a chance of signing any so it comes as no suprise to me that they can offer Hansen a higher portion of cap space than we can. Every player is only worth so much before it's better to take the money than try to match it, otherwise we end up losing players elsewhere who might not be so easily replaceable. As much as I do value Hansen he isn't a player I'd want us to get into a bidding war for at the expense of the squad as a whole

Re: Hansen signs for Salford - official : Wed Dec 18, 2013 6:23 pm  

DaveO wrote:

I don't think they are assuming loyalty particularly in Josie's case but a desire not to move in the first place. And as to players doing PR, I agree and H isn't likely to say anything negative about joining Salford now he has for this reason. Now the deal is done he may well be settled in his own mind this is a good thing and has bought into it but that doesn't mean that was his starting position.

I agree with you about this being a bad loss and that it is about money. Why we were not prepared to match Salford I have no idea given the dearth of players of H's standard. My view is as H said on Wigan TV, he would stay here as long as he was wanted and I don't think he had to qualify that by saying "but not on a poor wage compared to elsewhere" which you take as read.

I believe had we offered as much he'd still be here so any talk of loyalty to us or desire to play for Salford are both equally spurious issues. It's about money and IL wasn't preprepared to spend it IMO. A mistake I feel.

I'm sure he'd love to stay at Wigan for the rest of his career - it's a comfortable environment, he's idolised by the fans, good facilities, good chance of winning silverware etc. Whether Wigan offered him a 'poor wage' or not, I don't know. Naturally his supporters are going to say we did.

But I suspect it's more a case of that old vexed issue about who’s valuation of the player is more realistic. And while I know you’re often intolerant of the explanation that Wigan staff are in a better position to judge than we fans, there’s really no getting away from the truth that they will have a much better angle on his medical condition, his physical longevity, his mental state, his overall contribution in training and on match-day, the potential for him to be replaced quickly etc – and they must base their valuation on that.

Here’s a serious question. If Wigan were in a bidding war with Salford, and Salford offered vastly more than anyone at Wigan thought the player was worth, would you expect IL to continue with the bidding regardless, or to draw a line in the sand?

I’m disappointed that Hansen has gone. But I don’t think there’s much of a mystery here, or that the club are behaving in a particularly Machiavellian way.

Re: Hansen signs for Salford - official : Thu Dec 19, 2013 10:01 am  

Binosh wrote:

H did not want to leave Wigan.
Wane really did not want him to go.
Rads really did not want him to go.
The team really did not want him to go.
The fans did not want him to go (and H knows this)

Lenagan should not mistake loyalty for stupidity, Wane wanted to offer the money, Lenagan did not, simple.

H has a family and a future to look at after Rugby League and has made a very smart move in my opinion, but I can assure you he is gutted he's leaving. The contract Wigan offered was nothing short of disgusting.

Please don't make me laugh.

Wigan will have offered H a contact that was acceptable for a player of his standing in the side. If Salford come in and offer twice as much then it's not up to Wigan to match it.

All this rests on the shoulders of Hansen and no one else. If he really wanted to stay then he'd have stayed. At the end of the day he's been blinded by £ signs and whilst you're correct that he's got a future to look after he's also got a legacy to cement.

There's reasons why some of the Leeds squad took paycuts to remain part of a successfull side.