Re: Letter from Leneghan : Sat Jul 04, 2020 11:58 am  

https://justthenews.com/accountability/ ... sing-group

https://justthenews.com/accountability/ ... sing-group

Re: Letter from Leneghan : Mon Jul 06, 2020 12:30 pm  

Jukesays wrote:

You are absolutely clueless!!!!

Ignore 20 other points where your wrong, and focus on a point where you know what, your wrong!

I did not throw my Weight behind the BLM UK group, in FACT I defended the club for promoting the LBGTQ movement
As far as I am aware the club haven't made ANY comments about BLM???

You and you alone said " I will not give my money to a club that inserts itself into non RL related social issues"
The only issue Wigan have made any kind of statement about is LBGTQ

So are you
1/not giving money to Wigan because you don't agree with them supporting LBGTQ?
Or
2/ Are you not giving any money to Wigan because of BLM UK - Which just to clarify they haven't yet said or done anything to support

If it's 1 then ok, but it's ridiculous
If it's 2 then ok, whatever, your not giving money to our club because of something they haven't done or said???

Let's get this straight
I'm all in favour of the club supporting the LGBTQ message - if a group of people who are from that world attach themselves to that group or form another group that uses the same message to then promote other issues such as Murder is ok, Drink Driving is ok or anything else that is abhorrent then I will not support that group, But I will support the LGBTQ Message
If the Club on restart wear the BLM message I will support them, If they donate 100k to BLM UK I won't support that, but I will still support the message.

Now I appreciate there is a whole different more nuanced conversation to be had which you seem to be incapable of having- And over on the Sin Bin there are very many different arguments & Debates being had (Which I notice your not part of).

But the original statement was :- "Im sorry but over recent times i have seen the club take a direction i do not like. I will not give my money to a club that inserts itself into non RL related social issues and i know a lot of people that feel the same way and are disgusted. I support Wigan to watch them play rugby league not to have the latest social trends forced down my throat."

So what "Social Trend" have the club shoved down your throat? and was any of that anything to do with the BLM "Message"?
As I originally said, your argument IMO is more about having a pop at IFL etc. for any reason, even when they haven't done what your suggesting.

Once again you are wrong. You know you are wrong and are now trying to twist this to make it an LGBTQ argument. I know your type, ive dealt with marxists for years and they always try to twist the argument when they are proven wrong. You are now trying to work towards accusing me of being anti-LGBTQ but it wont work. I am not your weak brother in law that you browbeat at the dinner table every Sunday. If i was anti-LGBTQ i wold of brought this up many months ago when the club started promoting such, i didnt, i brought it up when the club backed BLM on Facebook.

The clubs social media promoted BLM weeks ago when all the other major brands decided to jump on the bandwagon. The only reason i gave an opinion on the club promoting LGBTQ is because somebody asked me specifically about it. I simply said that i do not think Wigan should get involved in such matters, social issues are not what people go to watch RL for but that was not the intent behind my original post. You clearly threw your weight behind BLM and went straight on the attack like a rabid dog when i denounced the group. Now that major brands are trying to back away from the group, so are you.

Now perhaps Wigan did not intend to show support for the BLM group but rather they wanted to support racial equality or perhaps they did not fully understand what the BLM group really stands for? If that is the case they should come out and explain so but the silence is deafening, in which case i reserve the right to vote with my wallet.

Re: Letter from Leneghan : Mon Jul 06, 2020 12:39 pm  

Pieman wrote:

https://justthenews.com/accountability/donations-black-lives-matter-are-funnelled-through-democratic-fundraising-group

Exactly.

Coicidence that the Biden campaign suddenly had a massive financial boost in June?

Re: Letter from Leneghan : Mon Jul 06, 2020 3:39 pm  

Pieman wrote:

https://justthenews.com/accountability/donations-black-lives-matter-are-funnelled-through-democratic-fundraising-group

I haven't had chance to do too much research on the group that the money goes to but will in time
There is a big difference between money from BLM going to a political party and the money going to a company that takes their 4% (Similar to what Paypal/Gofund me etc. do?) and then that company in turn deciding to use it's profit to support the Democratic party

What I would say is the list of groups supporting the Republican party & it's "White Power" message can s easily be created

Re: Letter from Leneghan : Mon Jul 06, 2020 3:40 pm  

The_Enforcer wrote:

Exactly.

Coicidence that the Biden campaign suddenly had a massive financial boost in June?

Would you like to list the Republican parties list of donators?

Re: Letter from Leneghan : Mon Jul 06, 2020 4:06 pm  

The_Enforcer wrote:

Once again you are wrong. You know you are wrong and are now trying to twist this to make it an LGBTQ argument. I know your type, ive dealt with marxists for years and they always try to twist the argument when they are proven wrong. You are now trying to work towards accusing me of being anti-LGBTQ but it wont work. I am not your weak brother in law that you browbeat at the dinner table every Sunday. If i was anti-LGBTQ i wold of brought this up many months ago when the club started promoting such, i didnt, i brought it up when the club backed BLM on Facebook.

The clubs social media promoted BLM weeks ago when all the other major brands decided to jump on the bandwagon. The only reason i gave an opinion on the club promoting LGBTQ is because somebody asked me specifically about it. I simply said that i do not think Wigan should get involved in such matters, social issues are not what people go to watch RL for but that was not the intent behind my original post. You clearly threw your weight behind BLM and went straight on the attack like a rabid dog when i denounced the group. Now that major brands are trying to back away from the group, so are you.

Now perhaps Wigan did not intend to show support for the BLM group but rather they wanted to support racial equality or perhaps they did not fully understand what the BLM group really stands for? If that is the case they should come out and explain so but the silence is deafening, in which case i reserve the right to vote with my wallet.

You had the opportunity to explain what "Social Trends" you disagreed with, until now you haven't responded??? So until this point the ONLY issue I could tangibly make a link to was LGBTQ and in fact Egg chasing asked you specifically, but you didn't clarify.
As I have no idea what Wigan Warriors have posted on Facebook & Twitter I'll reserve the right to judge their stance when I know what they have and haven't said.

Either way your stance is quite clear, you don't want Wigan backing certain causes?
BLM
LGBTQ movement

Any others?
Because ALL messages/movements have some kind of organising/official group that sound behind them - Just want to know if you agree with other messages whilst not the political/organising group behind them.

As for making out I'm going on the attack like a rabid dog, or being a verbal bully in terms of the downbeaten brother in law jibe, or being a Marxist then I'm afraid you couldn't be further from the truth. Your attempt to paint me in a particular light may work with some, discredit the person, discredit the message, it certainly seems to be what some of the leaders of the "Right" movements have been doing over the last 4/5 years.
But most people will see it for what it is, Gaslighting, deflection technique

Anyway - You've made your point now and in a round about way answered my question
Your not going to give your money to a club that supports ANY "Social Trend" or "Political Movement"?

That's fine as not being a ST holder (Which doesn't matter but you have been asked and not answered so I can only assume your not) the club doesn't have any of your money - But if you were they would give it you back.
and/or your a walk up supporter so you won't need to put any money in
or
You don't go anyway so again that won't matter

And above in all instances your welcome to make your own decision.

I agree I was wrong on one thing
I thought you weren't putting your money in because of IFL/Rads etc.
Now I agree it's because of that and the fact their club back those political movements such as BLM/LBGTQ or any other days that "Could" be construed in that way such as NHS & Armed forces day

You keep saving for that Holiday to Florida? I would warn you against it but I know it's a Hoax & Fake News

Re: Letter from Leneghan : Mon Jul 06, 2020 5:09 pm  

Jukesays wrote:

I haven't had chance to do too much research on the group that the money goes to but will in time
There is a big difference between money from BLM going to a political party and the money going to a company that takes their 4% (Similar to what Paypal/Gofund me etc. do?) and then that company in turn deciding to use it's profit to support the Democratic party

What I would say is the list of groups supporting the Republican party & it's "White Power" message can s easily be created

I’ll try find it for you pal, there’s a list of donations going straight to the party also in the millions, I don’t disagree with the message as racism needs kicking into touch, don’t agree with their methods

Re: Letter from Leneghan : Mon Jul 06, 2020 5:30 pm  

Pieman wrote:

I’ll try find it for you pal, there’s a list of donations going straight to the party also in the millions, I don’t disagree with the message as racism needs kicking into touch, don’t agree with their methods

As I've said before - If the money donated to BLM goes straight to the Democratic party then that would be wrong
If this company are taking their "Cut" - Then they pass on the remaining 96% or whatever then it is up to them what they do with their 4%

Some people may not want that company to do that, but it is their right
No different than the NRA making massive donations to the Republican party or Healthcare companies doing the same - So Donald continues his De-regulation etc.

The bit about "don’t agree with their methods" I would like to understand more, as I have seen a lot of allegations without seeing much evidence (BLMUK is a totally different situation)
However for example
"Defund the Police" is a completely different set-up/Message in USA
I have watched dozens of programs on the American Law enforcement set up over the last 4/5 years - And A LOT of those programs/documentaries etc. are critical of a lot of the way that it is set up - Not going to Bore everyone anymore, but basically the "Defund the Police Message" is more about stopping the increase in police budget and asking them to deal with EVERY issue out there from Marital/Drug/Social/Mental health issues etc. and put more funds into the specialist departments that deal with those issues.
It's a Bat S*** Crazy country - I don't like the way our leadership with Brexit etc. are mimicking their methods & Messages which are based on Gaslighting/Blame culture & dismissing EVERY message that doesn't fit their stance as "Fake News" or a Hoax.

Anyway

Good on the club for investing in players whilst in the midst of such a difficult situation
If my & my families £300/400 for the remainder of my ST's price for 2020 has been used or in some way made the clubs decision to reinvest in John Bateman and help retain younger players coming through easier then I'm absolutely fine with that.

Re: Letter from Leneghan : Mon Jul 06, 2020 6:00 pm  

Jukesays wrote:

You had the opportunity to explain what "Social Trends" you disagreed with, until now you haven't responded??? So until this point the ONLY issue I could tangibly make a link to was LGBTQ and in fact Egg chasing asked you specifically, but you didn't clarify.
As I have no idea what Wigan Warriors have posted on Facebook & Twitter I'll reserve the right to judge their stance when I know what they have and haven't said.

Either way your stance is quite clear, you don't want Wigan backing certain causes?
BLM
LGBTQ movement

Any others?
Because ALL messages/movements have some kind of organising/official group that sound behind them - Just want to know if you agree with other messages whilst not the political/organising group behind them.

As for making out I'm going on the attack like a rabid dog, or being a verbal bully in terms of the downbeaten brother in law jibe, or being a Marxist then I'm afraid you couldn't be further from the truth. Your attempt to paint me in a particular light may work with some, discredit the person, discredit the message, it certainly seems to be what some of the leaders of the "Right" movements have been doing over the last 4/5 years.
But most people will see it for what it is, Gaslighting, deflection technique

Anyway - You've made your point now and in a round about way answered my question
Your not going to give your money to a club that supports ANY "Social Trend" or "Political Movement"?

That's fine as not being a ST holder (Which doesn't matter but you have been asked and not answered so I can only assume your not) the club doesn't have any of your money - But if you were they would give it you back.
and/or your a walk up supporter so you won't need to put any money in
or
You don't go anyway so again that won't matter

And above in all instances your welcome to make your own decision.

I agree I was wrong on one thing
I thought you weren't putting your money in because of IFL/Rads etc.
Now I agree it's because of that and the fact their club back those political movements such as BLM/LBGTQ or any other days that "Could" be construed in that way such as NHS & Armed forces day

You keep saving for that Holiday to Florida? I would warn you against it but I know it's a Hoax & Fake News

Is this a bad time to ask Enforcer to contribute to the Wigan RL Covid fund?

Re: Letter from Leneghan : Mon Jul 06, 2020 6:45 pm  

Jukesays wrote:

As I've said before - If the money donated to BLM goes straight to the Democratic party then that would be wrong
If this company are taking their "Cut" - Then they pass on the remaining 96% or whatever then it is up to them what they do with their 4%

Some people may not want that company to do that, but it is their right
No different than the NRA making massive donations to the Republican party or Healthcare companies doing the same - So Donald continues his De-regulation etc.

The bit about "don’t agree with their methods" I would like to understand more, as I have seen a lot of allegations without seeing much evidence (BLMUK is a totally different situation)
However for example
"Defund the Police" is a completely different set-up/Message in USA
I have watched dozens of programs on the American Law enforcement set up over the last 4/5 years - And A LOT of those programs/documentaries etc. are critical of a lot of the way that it is set up - Not going to Bore everyone anymore, but basically the "Defund the Police Message" is more about stopping the increase in police budget and asking them to deal with EVERY issue out there from Marital/Drug/Social/Mental health issues etc. and put more funds into the specialist departments that deal with those issues.
It's a Bat S*** Crazy country - I don't like the way our leadership with Brexit etc. are mimicking their methods & Messages which are based on Gaslighting/Blame culture & dismissing EVERY message that doesn't fit their stance as "Fake News" or a Hoax.

Anyway

Good on the club for investing in players whilst in the midst of such a difficult situation
If my & my families £300/400 for the remainder of my ST's price for 2020 has been used or in some way made the clubs decision to reinvest in John Bateman and help retain younger players coming through easier then I'm absolutely fine with that.

wish I was a season ticket holder this year so I could have said the same but every home game fell on my weekend on joined the lotto and bought from the shop as most have my family has, would love to donate towards the fundraiser if it happens also