Re: George Williams : Mon Jun 21, 2021 8:23 am  

muttywhitedog wrote:

Bottom line is that he didnt want to come back and play for us, just as Edwards didnt want to come back and coach us.

If its not about money, then there is something going on behind the scenes that is putting folk off coming back to Wigan. Something that IL doesnt want to let the fans know - otherwise why wouldnt he push for a compensation package from GW/Wire for reneging on a legally binding deal?

What do you think that is?

A secret reign of terror instigated by IL and KR? A culture of utter ruthlessness? A total lack of moral scruple? Inflexibility on an epic scale when it comes to contract enforcement etc?

All the evidence suggests the exact opposite is true. Whatever the problem, it didn't prevent Bateman coming back, or Sarginson, or Budgie.

And I wouldn't use IL's refusal to sue Williams as proof that something is wrong. How would it look, trying to legally oblige someone to play for us who really doesn't want to? And who wants to get into court cases etc? Look at what happened with Iestyn Harris. After all that fuss, the guy was rubbish when he finally started playing again.

Better just to accept that for whatever reason, both Edwards and Williams changed their mind (Edwards gave various reasons depending on who was interviewing him), while Williams seems to be in a bit of a mess at the moment and clearly wants some kind of fresh start.

All we really know is that two sons of Wigan have dumped on the Wigan club. I don't understand why it always has to be Wigan's fault.

Re: George Williams : Mon Jun 21, 2021 9:03 am  

IMO there’s 2 realistic reasons he’s not coming back.

1: The Warrington financial offer was too good to turn down.

2: He simply wants a new challenge. I’m sure he’s noticed that the players who have returned have generally struggled when they’ve come back. I can’t think of a single one who has been better than when they left and he felt as though the same would happen to him.

Maybe he also felt his chances of silverware are better at Warrington than Wigan. When you look at the players they are signing and being linked with compared to us I can’t blame him for that.

I don’t see this being indicative of problems behind the scenes at Wigan. He’s the only player thus far that we wanted to re-sign and haven’t.

It could be a blessing in disguise for us if we invest the budget we would have paid Williams into a couple of decent props.

Re: George Williams : Mon Jun 21, 2021 10:00 am  

100% Warrior wrote:

Toronto used to pay huge signing on fees, which I believe do not count towards the cap, and a fairly standard salary £30-60k per year. I don’t know if Wire have done this with GW mind but notably they haven’t announced his signing as of yet so there’s clearly a few issues to iron out.

Such a strategy wouldn't make a difference to cap spend. The proportion of the cap taken up by a player is determined by their 'salary cap value', this is a figure determined by the governing body and isn't necessarily the same as the amount going into their pay packet. If the governing body determine that a player is worth £150k (Williams' likely value if he is a marquee player at Warrington) then a club cannot pay him less than that in order to fit him in under their cap limit. If they could do that then Warrington would not be looking to shift players to accommodate signing him. Warrington can pay Williams as much or as little as they wish to, and he agrees to, but it is the governing body that will decide how much of their allotted cap he takes up regardless of his wages.

Re: George Williams : Mon Jun 21, 2021 11:01 am  

wiganermike wrote:

Such a strategy wouldn't make a difference to cap spend. The proportion of the cap taken up by a player is determined by their 'salary cap value', this is a figure determined by the governing body and isn't necessarily the same as the amount going into their pay packet. If the governing body determine that a player is worth £150k (Williams' likely value if he is a marquee player at Warrington) then a club cannot pay him less than that in order to fit him in under their cap limit. If they could do that then Warrington would not be looking to shift players to accommodate signing him. Warrington can pay Williams as much or as little as they wish to, and he agrees to, but it is the governing body that will decide how much of their allotted cap he takes up regardless of his wages.

Learn something new everyday

Re: George Williams : Mon Jun 21, 2021 11:02 am  

Trainman wrote:

IMO there’s 2 realistic reasons he’s not coming back.

1: The Warrington financial offer was too good to turn down.

2: He simply wants a new challenge. I’m sure he’s noticed that the players who have returned have generally struggled when they’ve come back. I can’t think of a single one who has been better than when they left and he felt as though the same would happen to him.

Maybe he also felt his chances of silverware are better at Warrington than Wigan. When you look at the players they are signing and being linked with compared to us I can’t blame him for that.

I don’t see this being indicative of problems behind the scenes at Wigan. He’s the only player thus far that we wanted to re-sign and haven’t.

It could be a blessing in disguise for us if we invest the budget we would have paid Williams into a couple of decent props.

I agree with this but I also think there may be 3rd reason. The unfair abuse and criticism he got from an awful lot of our fans in his last season before going to Canberra was embarrassing at times. The lad is a cracking player and never gave us less than 100%. If he read half the comments that were written about him I’m not surprised he didn’t want to come back.

Re: George Williams : Mon Jun 21, 2021 11:19 am  

Bigredwarrior wrote:

I agree with this but I also think there may be 3rd reason. The unfair abuse and criticism he got from an awful lot of our fans in his last season before going to Canberra was embarrassing at times. The lad is a cracking player and never gave us less than 100%. If he read half the comments that were written about him I’m not surprised he didn’t want to come back.

He’ll need a thick skin at Warrington then and best be good at ducking in case a season ticket hits him.

Re: George Williams : Mon Jun 21, 2021 12:04 pm  

If he doesn't perform they'll be burning shirts with his name on the back like they did with Matt King.

Re: George Williams : Mon Jun 21, 2021 2:35 pm  

NickyKiss wrote:

He’ll need a thick skin at Warrington then and best be good at ducking in case a season ticket hits him.

maybe he'll get homesick....

Re: George Williams : Mon Jun 21, 2021 6:47 pm  

Left out of the England squad.

George Williams has been urged to find a new club quickly after being left out of England's squad to face the Combined Nations All Stars.

The half-back had been named in Shaun Wane's initial 24-man party, but is not fit to take part in Friday's match at Warrington's Halliwell Jones Stadium.

Williams, 26, has not played since 22 May after being released by Canberra Raiders on compassionate grounds and Leeds captain Luke Gale and St Helens stand-off Jonny Lomax come in as half-backs.

Warrington full-back Stefan Ratchford is another half-back option for Wane as Williams, linked with the Wolves himself, was given a message by the England coach.

Wane told BBC Radio 5 Live's Rugby League Podcast that "it is very important George Williams gets fixed up with a club and gets some games under his belt".

Wire centre Toby King misses out after picking up a knee injury in their win over St Helens while Salford Red Devils full-back Dan Sarginson is ruled out after being given a three-match ban following his side's narrow success at Huddersfield Giants.

The Giants' Jermaine McGillvary and Jake Wardle have also been cut from the final 19-man squad.

Six uncapped players are named in the line-up, with wingers Tom Davies and Ash Handley, loose forward Morgan Knowles, prop Mikolaj Oledzki, back rower Joe Philbin and reigning Super League Man of Steel Paul McShane set for their England debuts.

England (from): John Bateman (Wigan Warriors); Daryl Clark, Mike Cooper, Ben Currie (all Warrington Wolves); Tom Davies (Catalans Dragons); Liam Farrell (Wigan Warriors); Luke Gale, Ash Handley (both Leeds Rhinos); Morgan Knowles (St Helens); Reece Lyne (Wakefield Trinity); Jonny Lomax (St Helens); Paul McShane (Castleford Tigers); Tommy Makinson (St Helens); Mikolaj Oledzki (Leeds Rhinos); Joe Philbin, Stefan Ratchford (both Warrington Wolves); Sam Tomkins (Catalans Dragons); Alex Walmsley (St Helens); Joe Westerman (Wakefield Trinity).

Re: George Williams : Tue Jun 22, 2021 12:59 pm  

Pie_Eyter wrote:

Let me put it another way. what does he do so much better as a half that lads like Richardson, Drinkwater and Lolohea can't do to warrant being paid so much more than them? I would genuinely like to know.

On another note, the lads that come over from Australia with their big reputations and even bigger ego's ALWAYS fail. It's the hidden gems like Carmont and Richards we need to be seeking out. What the hell happened to our scouting set up. I will do it Mr. Lenegan, give me a grand a week and i will find you a top player from one of the feeder leagues.

Pat Richards?

He wasn't a hidden gem. He came to Wigan after a very good season with the Tigers. Was instrumental in that team winning the premiership.