Re: If you must discuss Union, do it here II : Sun May 15, 2011 7:22 am  

I think Paul Ackford had a few things to say: Paul Ackford, dailytelegraph.co.uk wrote: The real story of what should have been one of the showpiece occasions of the domestic rugby calendar was the disgraceful behaviour of Richard Cockerill, Leicester’s director of rugby, and fellow coach Matt O’Connor as they ranted throughout the game in a foul-mouthed attempt to intimidate Brian Campsall, who was assessing match referee Wayne Barnes. I have covered this sport for the past 15 years and I have never heard or seen anything like it. In the second period especially, at any break in play, or at any decision given against Leicester, either Cockerill or O’Connor, sometimes both, would jump to their feet, red-faced, to gesticulate and swear at Campsall, who was sitting six seats away from them in the box reserved for coaches, various rugby officials and Leicester guests http://www.telegraph.co.uk/sport/rugbyunion/club/8514049/Leicester-Tigers-11-Northampton-Saints-3-match-report.html

I think Paul Ackford had a few things to say: Paul Ackford, dailytelegraph.co.uk wrote: The real story of what should have been one of the showpiece occasions of the domestic rugby calendar was the disgraceful behaviour of Richard Cockerill, Leicester’s director of rugby, and fellow coach Matt O’Connor as they ranted throughout the game in a foul-mouthed attempt to intimidate Brian Campsall, who was assessing match referee Wayne Barnes. I have covered this sport for the past 15 years and I have never heard or seen anything like it. In the second period especially, at any break in play, or at any decision given against Leicester, either Cockerill or O’Connor, sometimes both, would jump to their feet, red-faced, to gesticulate and swear at Campsall, who was sitting six seats away from them in the box reserved for coaches, various rugby officials and Leicester guests http://www.telegraph.co.uk/sport/rugbyunion/club/8514049/Leicester-Tigers-11-Northampton-Saints-3-match-report.html

Re: If you must discuss Union, do it here II : Sun May 15, 2011 8:43 am  

cjhatesunion wrote:

RL fans on the whole are decent people.

Decent people ??? Remember Colin, Michelle is a Salford fan

Re: If you must discuss Union, do it here II : Sun May 15, 2011 8:44 am  

Catalancs wrote:

Maybe cos he doesn't know what day it is.

Yet to see anyone comment on the other 79 minutes 45 seconds. The game itself must have been very poor viewing.

Actually it was a great game ......... very physical, awesome defence, and totally absorbing.

Re: If you must discuss Union, do it here II : Sun May 15, 2011 9:05 am  

nickcat0 wrote:

Actually it was a great game ......... very physical, awesome defence, and totally absorbing.

Will look to see if it's repeated on Spanish tv then.

Re: If you must discuss Union, do it here II : Sun May 15, 2011 11:03 am  

Catalancs wrote:

Maybe cos he doesn't know what day it is.

Yet to see anyone comment on the other 79 minutes 45 seconds. The game itself must have been very poor viewing.

I haven't seen the game (other than brief highlights), but from what I've seen and hear it was a good game of rugby, that Leicester could have won quite easily if Toby Flood was on form with the boot.

People haven't commented on the rest of the game because this was such a big part of the match, featuring an almightly balls up from the officials.

Re: If you must discuss Union, do it here II : Sun May 15, 2011 12:06 pm  

Shark J wrote:

What, our stadium?
Not sure what's gonna be going on really. I'd imagine that we'd respect Salford's wishes and that they've planned this for many years but we'd prefer a say somewhere along the line. As I said on our own board - I'm excited at the prospect of a new stadium with good facilities, standing areas, COVERED stands all round. But if we were to ground share forever then I would want it to feel like it's ours. Not sure how I'd feel about being in a stadium forever with Salford City Reds all over it, red seats, Salford spelt out on the seats..

Surely Salford's stadium would, as you put it, have 'Salford City Reds all over it, red seats, Salford spelt out on the seats'. From what I've heard from Salford fans on the subject of potential ground-sharing, it would very much be a case of Sale Sharks playing at Salford Reds' ground.

Shark J wrote:

Now that's not trying to get anybody annoyed. But you can appreciate that although Stockport is home, it has always felt like a temporary home. I wonder how much the minimum ground requirements have stopped us moving to our own ground in the past. Kennedy has said for a long time that if we could guarantee an average crowd of 15,000 he would get us a new stadium, but of course now we're in a state where that's a million miles off. But with all the tension with Stockport I imagine the best solution would have been to get us a basic little ground, with the room for expansion. The ground requirements are daft and it's preventing the smaller teams from being able to develop and compete. So what if Cornish Pirates ground only holds 3000? It's not Football. They're hardly going to stampede or anything. Rugby fans are used to traditional grounds, most don't want all seater stadiums with no character.

I must admit I do feel for Sale Sharks fans in that sense. Leaving Central Park was a wrench and while I do call the DW home it will never feel like home. Playing for around a decade (is that right?) in a 'temporary' ground that doesn't feel like your own must be tough going and maybe that has affected your crowds. I've always thought that Sale Sharks would benefit immensely from their own stadium, taking two or three big games on the road to places like The Reebok, Eastlands and one of the Liverpool football grounds. The potential for the club is massive when you consider they are the only top flight professional rugby union club in the whole North-West.

Shark J wrote:

And while you're all talking about the no relegation thing - please don't think it's a rip off of League. I mean, of course it's going to be compared to it. But in terms of Rugby, the Premiership is one of few leagues that still has promotion and relegation.

I can't think of another major sport in Britain, maybe Europe where there is no relegationand promotion when it comes to the top division so yes, comparisons are obviously going to be made. It could be argued that the licence system is unique outside the US and although it has its critics it has done enough to have fans of other sports looking on and taking notes.

Shark J wrote:

I do feel it's time to adapt to the league franchise style - but only if it helps the lower divisions. It's no good ring fencing it all off and then in 3 years time the gulf being even bigger. And that's the only negative for Super League for me now. I'm not the biggest fan of League, but in the games I do watch the skill level and speed seems to have gone up so much. The gulf between the top 2 flights seems to be ridiculously big and I think The Challenge Cup results show that. As a lot of people like to point out, effectively there are only 14 competing Rugby Union sides in England anyway. Worcester and Bristol being the other 2 outside of the top flight. But then the last season has shown just how damaging the modern game can be with Bristol being whipping boys and finishing 8th.

In effect the current Premiership and division one situation is a stone's throw from the rugby league licensing system. If you're going to claim real promotion and relegation then I'd love to see a genuine union club such as the Pirates playing the likes of Wasps, Bath and Leicester on a weekly basis. Sure they might get soundly spanked each week but at least they'd have the chance to live the dream as it were.

As you say, you're not a fan of rugby league so I'm guessing you don't watch too much. This could explain the comment regarding the massive gap between Super League and The Championships. While I doubt anyone would deny a difference between the two the last round of the famous Challenge Cup showed that it's anything but 'ridiculously big'.

St Helens 52 Sheffield 26
Leigh 16 Catalan Dragons 22
Halifax 34 Bradford 46
Batley 18 Huddersfield 28

Now I doubt that those clubs would struggle to perform like that week in week out, but the fact of the matter is that they gave Super League sides a real battle. Some of the rugby played in The Championships is cracking fayre and well worth watching on Sky on Thursday evening's. In fact there's a game on tonight, Sheffield v Leigh 5:00pm Sky Sports 2.

Re: If you must discuss Union, do it here II : Sun May 15, 2011 7:06 pm  

nickcat0 wrote:

Decent people ??? Remember Colin, Michelle is a Salford fan

True nick,forgot about that.

Re: If you must discuss Union, do it here II : Sun May 15, 2011 7:07 pm  

nickcat0 wrote:

Actually it was a great game ......... very physical, awesome defence, and totally absorbing.

Now I know you have completely lost it.

Re: If you must discuss Union, do it here II : Mon May 16, 2011 6:25 pm  

Catalancs wrote:

Surely Salford's stadium would, as you put it, have 'Salford City Reds all over it, red seats, Salford spelt out on the seats'. From what I've heard from Salford fans on the subject of potential ground-sharing, it would very much be a case of Sale Sharks playing at Salford Reds' ground.


I must admit I do feel for Sale Sharks fans in that sense. Leaving Central Park was a wrench and while I do call the DW home it will never feel like home. Playing for around a decade (is that right?) in a 'temporary' ground that doesn't feel like your own must be tough going and maybe that has affected your crowds. I've always thought that Sale Sharks would benefit immensely from their own stadium, taking two or three big games on the road to places like The Reebok, Eastlands and one of the Liverpool football grounds. The potential for the club is massive when you consider they are the only top flight professional rugby union club in the whole North-West.


I can't think of another major sport in Britain, maybe Europe where there is no relegationand promotion when it comes to the top division so yes, comparisons are obviously going to be made. It could be argued that the licence system is unique outside the US and although it has its critics it has done enough to have fans of other sports looking on and taking notes.

In effect the current Premiership and division one situation is a stone's throw from the rugby league licensing system. If you're going to claim real promotion and relegation then I'd love to see a genuine union club such as the Pirates playing the likes of Wasps, Bath and Leicester on a weekly basis. Sure they might get soundly spanked each week but at least they'd have the chance to live the dream as it were.

As you say, you're not a fan of rugby league so I'm guessing you don't watch too much. This could explain the comment regarding the massive gap between Super League and The Championships. While I doubt anyone would deny a difference between the two the last round of the famous Challenge Cup showed that it's anything but 'ridiculously big'.

St Helens 52 Sheffield 26
Leigh 16 Catalan Dragons 22
Halifax 34 Bradford 46
Batley 18 Huddersfield 28

Now I doubt that those clubs would struggle to perform like that week in week out, but the fact of the matter is that they gave Super League sides a real battle. Some of the rugby played in The Championships is cracking fayre and well worth watching on Sky on Thursday evening's. In fact there's a game on tonight, Sheffield v Leigh 5:00pm Sky Sports 2.

You missed out Wigan demolishing Barrow and Warrington doing the same to Keighley. I wouldn't say St Helens and Sheffield is a competitive result, but I take your point on the others. I watched some of the Halifax game. I do watch a bit of League, probably more will be watched now the Football and Union season's are coming to a close. I watched Widnes vs Wigan in the Challenge Cup last year and it was a similar score. Wigan put 80 odd, maybe 90 odd past them and it didn't feel fun as it was just that easy.

Yeah, we've been there since 2003 I think. I'm only a youngster so I wasn't there in the Heywood Road days. I completely agree though. Seeing as we're becoming more and more a franchise and the club don't give a fook about us being called Sale or having 1861 on the shirts which is important to a lot of people. We're basically seen as a regional side to some. So why not treat it that way? The Ospreys play some of their games in Bridgend. We have a big fanbase and 3 places that I always notice have a lot of Sale fans you might not expect are Macclesfield, Bury and Stoke. Maybe take a cup game to Moss Rose, Gigg Lane or Vale Park as nobody really cares about them anyway. I think trying to play at the big Football grounds would be too much of a risk and it would look empty on the tele.

I also agree about Wigan. I go on the Wigan board a bit as they're my League team (wouldn't call myself a fan, just like to see them do well along with a few others, went to the grand final, that Widnes game and Castleford in the play-offs in 2009)

I never realised just how hostile it is with Wigan Athletic. I guess the good thing for you is that 3 times a year you can sell the ground out and a few more times you can get it close to. A lot of Union sides hate playing in a Football ground because it's soulless. Cardiff are a massive example. I don't know if any fan likes the new ground and they all love The Arms Park.

As for the license thing. The Magners League is the prime example in Union. That League is rubbish and I'd hate to support one of the Irish provinces. All they seem to care about is The Heineken Cup. The league itself doesn't seem to be competitive with their being no relegation. The good thing about Super League is that it's not forever and you are bringing in and getting rid of teams every 3 years

The problem with bringing the other clubs in is that they couldn't afford it. If you look at The Premiership or at least the leagues in Union since they started then you'll see a list of teams you might have forgotten even existed. West Hartlepool, Wakefield and London Scottish all couldn't cope with professionalism. Bedford have been in the top flight many years back. Rotherham who now get spanked every other week. The teams, for whatever reason just couldn't afford to stay in the top flight.

Re: If you must discuss Union, do it here II : Mon May 16, 2011 6:40 pm  

Shark J wrote:

As for the license thing. The Magners League is the prime example in Union. That League is rubbish and I'd hate to support one of the Irish provinces. All they seem to care about is The Heineken Cup. The league itself doesn't seem to be competitive with their being no relegation. The good thing about Super League is that it's not forever and you are bringing in and getting rid of teams every 3 years.

One of the most accurate things I've ever seen posted on this site.