Re: The Football Chat Thread : Wed Nov 23, 2011 9:02 pm  

Kevin Prince Boateng take a bow son

Re: The Football Chat Thread : Wed Nov 23, 2011 9:51 pm  

Catalancs wrote:

Kevin Prince Boateng take a bow son

What did he do?

Re: The Football Chat Thread : Wed Nov 23, 2011 11:11 pm  

Dita's Slot Meter wrote:

I'm saying that City are in a stronger group than the other 3 English teams, who are basically in 'walkover' groups, though United are making a bit of a meal of their's.

If any of United, Chlesea or Arsenal were in City's group, I think all 3 would be struggling in a similar manner to how City are.

Possibly because it's a tough group but I still don't understand how it makes the PL weak though?

Re: The Football Chat Thread : Wed Nov 23, 2011 11:30 pm  

Dita's Slot Meter wrote:

I'm saying that City are in a stronger group than the other 3 English teams, who are basically in 'walkover' groups, though United are making a bit of a meal of their's.

If any of United, Chlesea or Arsenal were in City's group, I think all 3 would be struggling in a similar manner to how City are.

City are in a tough group, although I don't remember too much of the British press hyping Napoli up before it started. At the end of the day, City, with the amount invested in their squad and management, should be doing better than Napoli.

IMO, England have the strongest 'top half' (i.e. top 10 sides) of any league in Europe, i.e. if the top 10's all battled it off, England's would come out with the most points. I think the league has definitely dropped off a little in standard, largely because of the lack of top quality imports (how can Napoli and Atletico Madrid have better strikers than the top 4 sides?). When the English league was at its strongest, it had players like Ronaldo, Torres, Drogba, Gerrard, Fabregas, Essien, Tevez and many more at their best. Clubs still have strong players, but it's debatable that there is true top quality offensive talent in the league, even though United got to the CL final last year, IMO it was down to arguably the best defence in Europe, not Rooney, Nani and Hernandez.

I think the future of the league depends on how the clubs go about their player recruitment. There's plenty of talent out there that clubs could go for to compete, but I'd be surprised if they do. Look around the leagues, there's plenty of talent out there, but English clubs (especially Liverpool) don't seem too intent on picking it up. Chelsea spent about £70m on Torres, Meireles and Benayoun, when they could probably have got far more value signing younger players from a different league.

Re: The Football Chat Thread : Thu Nov 24, 2011 12:08 am  

Dita's Slot Meter wrote:

It probably exposes how poor the Premier League sides are, compared to the Real's, Barca's, Bayern's of this world, rather than it being a stain on just City.

United struggling to come through an awfully weak group, Chelsea are gradually get worse, week on week, and Arsenal are a pale shadow of the side they once were.

At least City have the excuse of being in a tough group, if United were to go out at this stage (though I think they won't), it would be hugely embarrassing and, at any other club, worthy of a massive question mark over the manager.

Citeh have a harder group than the other English sides, but they are in far better form than any of the other sides and any of the other English sides in good form would have gone through that group fairly easily.

Going out of the group stages in their first CL campaign won't be too bad. It's a stepping stone after all. But the only reason I even made a comment was because Mancini was saying that they're on a level with Real, Barca and Man United. That is a ridiculous statement to make when you're struggling against the might of Napoli to qualify for the knockout stages.

Re: The Football Chat Thread : Thu Nov 24, 2011 12:24 am  

Lord God Jose Mourinho wrote:

Going out of the group stages in their first CL campaign won't be too bad. It's a stepping stone after all.

Is it really though? It's not Mancini's first campaign, or Dzeko's, or Aguero's, or Silva's, or Nasri's, or Toure's, or Clichy's, or Balotelli's. City have plenty of players that are experienced and so is the coach; when you spend that much, not getting to the quarters should be considered horrendous. Also, might sound mad, but Napoli are also in the CL for the first time under their current 'rebirth'. Many of their players are making their CL debuts, so I don't think the stepping stone line is fair, not when there are vastly poorer clubs making it through in the same group (I know City could still go through, I'm just assuming they wont as I can't see Villarreal suddenly finding form).

Re: The Football Chat Thread : Thu Nov 24, 2011 12:42 am  

Roddy B wrote:

At the end of the day, City, with the amount invested in their squad and management, should be doing better than Napoli.

I suppose it does depend on the players they have bought though, just because they've spent money doesn't mean they should do better than other teams. We've been an example of that in the past, it'll never happen now but we've often been seen to be 'punching above our weight' when teams around us have spent mega bucks.

Roddy B wrote:

IMO, England have the strongest 'top half' (i.e. top 10 sides) of any league in Europe, i.e. if the top 10's all battled it off, England's would come out with the most points. I think the league has definitely dropped off a little in standard, largely because of the lack of top quality imports (how can Napoli and Atletico Madrid have better strikers than the top 4 sides?). When the English league was at its strongest, it had players like Ronaldo, Torres, Drogba, Gerrard, Fabregas, Essien, Tevez and many more at their best. Clubs still have strong players, but it's debatable that there is true top quality offensive talent in the league, even though United got to the CL final last year, IMO it was down to arguably the best defence in Europe, not Rooney, Nani and Hernandez.

Good post mate, I'd agree with that. I think Man Utd's success in CL was down to both offensive and defence though, defensively they were very good but at times they were very difficult for the opposition to handle. I think the quality is there, we've still got some world class talents throughout the league but I agree when you say the quality has dropped a little too, do you think it's down to teams over here staying too loyal to some players and not moving them on when they should I.E Chelsea keeping ageing players in their starting 11 week in week out instead of replacing them, take Atletico for example they shipped out Forlan, when things had possibly gone stale, and brought in Falcao - brilliant player. Should teams here be trying that tactic, a bit like Newcastle have done by letting Barton and Nolan go, ageing players on huge money, and brought in Cabaye and the like to replace them.

Roddy B wrote:

I think the future of the league depends on how the clubs go about their player recruitment. There's plenty of talent out there that clubs could go for to compete, but I'd be surprised if they do. Look around the leagues, there's plenty of talent out there, but English clubs (especially Liverpool) don't seem too intent on picking it up. Chelsea spent about £70m on Torres, Meireles and Benayoun, when they could probably have got far more value signing younger players from a different league.

We have seen this many times before havent we so why has it stopped? Wenger brought Fabregas and Henry etc for small fees, relatively unknown players and look how they developed. Ferguson bringing in Hernandez, again an unknown, but for the money they paid he's been exceptional. I wonder if teams are wary about making signings like these regular because they now cost more and there's a chance they won't work out and they think by bringing in established PL there's less of a risk?

Re: The Football Chat Thread : Thu Nov 24, 2011 12:48 am  

If Citeh focus totally on winning the league then they probably will. If they try and win everything then I think they could mess themselves up and win nothing.

I think this season Citeh should go 100% for the league and pretty much take anything that happens in the CL as a bonus.

Barca and Man United have built up their experience of fighting on all fronts, but it is hard to do.

Re: The Football Chat Thread : Thu Nov 24, 2011 8:09 am  

Roddy B wrote:

Is it really though? It's not Mancini's first campaign, or Dzeko's, or Aguero's, or Silva's, or Nasri's, or Toure's, or Clichy's, or Balotelli's. City have plenty of players that are experienced and so is the coach; when you spend that much, not getting to the quarters should be considered horrendous. Also, might sound mad, but Napoli are also in the CL for the first time under their current 'rebirth'. Many of their players are making their CL debuts, so I don't think the stepping stone line is fair, not when there are vastly poorer clubs making it through in the same group (I know City could still go through, I'm just assuming they wont as I can't see Villarreal suddenly finding form).

The players have plenty of european experience, individually, but collectively they have struggled. There's been an air of uncertainty and hesitancy about the performances. Its as if they're thinking "this is the CL, its different to the league so we have to play differently" but haven't really worked out what playing "differently" means. Napoli are in the same situation but have sensibly just played their normal game. They've fewer options so havent tied themselves in knots trying to "adapt".

And some of the players haven't played anywhere near to the standard we have seen in the league. Silva appears to be trying too hard, trying to beat too many players and then losing possession. De Jong looks scared to make a tackle.

In all of the games we've played there have been plenty of passages of play when we've looked good enough to have qualified with ease. But we've been severely punished during lulls in our play, paid for lapses in concentration.

Right from the off, the league has been seen as the priority, with the CL seen as something to aim for next season. But getting knocked out of any competition is a downer. Obviously the Napoli result makes the Liverpool game that bit more important. But it also means that the Carling Cup tie at Arsenal takes on much greater significance that it really deserves.

Re: The Football Chat Thread : Thu Nov 24, 2011 10:16 am  

Saddened! wrote:

What did he do?

Have you seen his goal yet?