Re: The Football Chat Thread : Sat Feb 04, 2012 12:00 am  

Roddy B wrote:

For me, neither happens. I know there are never any rules in football, but just looking at the two clubs, it's clear as day Jelavic will have to do a lot to adapt. Kenny Miller was Messi-lite in the SPL, but he was a hopeless runner in England. Jelavic has no doubt shown an ability to score in Scotland, but you have to remember he's playing for a massive power over there that can the freedom to do as they like during games. English football is much more competitive and he'll get fewer chances playing for Everton than he did for Rangers, and he'll be expected to take most of them. For me, he'll struggle initially, if he works hard Moyes will keep faith in him and he may end up getting 10-15 goals next season for Everton, if he becomes frustrated and doesn't buy into the work ethic, he'll probably end up sold to Celtic.

Or he works hard from tomorrow, takes his chance when he's played and scores goals between now and the end of the season and kicks on next season whe he's had a few months to settle into the side and into the Premier League. I think he will get plenty of chances, Saha has had many many chances set up for him this season he's just missed them. If he can be as clinical as he was in Scotland he'll go very well here and hopefully he will. I think every Evertonian knows life's completely different here to Scotland, we saw that with McFadden but Jelavic looks like he has the ability and he has the right attitude too. Moyes sounded him out before he went to Rangers too, as long time admirer Moyes can only have been encouraged by his time in Scotland.

Re: The Football Chat Thread : Sat Feb 04, 2012 12:24 am  

I don't think the papers are to blame for Giggs getting off so lightly. I think it is the oppo supporters who are letting him off.

I actually think Giggs and Terry have received similar treatment from the press. The press went out of their way to grab the stories. But with Terry the country reacted with disgust and outrage towards Terry, Giggs's far worse offence was pretty much ignored and treated with a shrug of the shoulder.

I don't know what JT is like as a person. I don't really care. I do know though that as a football player he has performed magnificently and bravely for my team and he has earned my respect and thanks for the way he has performed on the pitch. That's what is important to me. From the few interviews I've seen with him he seems an okay bloke. The stories that have been written about him have been mainly BS IMO. There have clearly been journos with an agenda against him and they've gone out of their way to hammer him.

The racism thing. The worst aspect of it all for me is if his excuse is BS. I raise my eyebrow over his initial defence, but I want to see the case against him before passing judgement. If he did abuse Ferdinand and came out with that story afterwards then I think he's the dumbest POS in the world and he needs to be shown the door.

But if he was telling the truth, if there was a misunderstanding between AF and JT and JT was just caught on camera saying, "I never called you a black ****" then the whole reaction is just nonsense.

Obviously you think he's guilty without even seeing any of the evidence. That's not a surprise.

Re: The Football Chat Thread : Sat Feb 04, 2012 12:54 am  

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Re: The Football Chat Thread : Sat Feb 04, 2012 12:57 am  

I've no opinion over the racism thing, as we're not privy to it (pixilated coverage, etc), so I'm not going to go head first into it, without knowing the TRUE facts.

On the other things, though, Terry (and his family) seems to me as a thoroughly irksome individual(s). Terry and Bridge were bosom buddies, yet he goes out and does the dirty on Bridge...let alone his wife and children.

'Journos' have been given the stories by Terry (and family), because, they (the Terry's) committed the crimes , the evidence was shown in courts. 'Journos' didn't have to muckrake


I'm just baffled by this false sense of loyalty (shown by many on here), to people who have 'misdemenoured'. Just accept it (if the misdemenours turn out to be true) and move on....don't just dismiss it, simply because he's a member of your favourite band/team/someone you fancy/member of family...people transgress...it's human nature.

Re: The Football Chat Thread : Sat Feb 04, 2012 1:01 am  

McClennan wrote:

Fellas you do know that City site is a satire don't you? lol.

I don't know anything about this website, It's the first I've ever seen of it.

Re: The Football Chat Thread : Sat Feb 04, 2012 1:01 am  

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Re: The Football Chat Thread : Sat Feb 04, 2012 1:06 am  

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flipper wrote: :IDEA: http://s3.amazonaws.com/data.tumblr.com ... %2BjZzU%3D It's in the blood Looks like the 1992 European Cup final against Barcelona at Wembley.

Re: The Football Chat Thread : Sat Feb 04, 2012 1:28 am  

lefty goldblatt wrote:

On the other things, though, Terry (and his family) seems to me as a thoroughly irksome individual(s). Terry and Bridge were bosom buddies, yet he goes out and does the dirty on Bridge...let alone his wife and children.

How do you know that Terry and Bridge were bosom buddies?

If Terry and Bridge were close friends, and if Bridge still had strong feelings for his ex then that is very low of Terry to do that (if he did it. The press are still very, very consistent with their use of "allegedly" every time they bring this up.)

From what I've read, Terry was one of 5 CFC players who screwed her. Bridge was the 3rd. Bridge happened to be stupid enough to get her pregnant. Bridge was already screwing around in the north west.

But the oppo fans paint it as Terry screws his best mates wife, treat him as the first man to cheat on his wife and treat him like a kiddie fiddler

'Journos' have been given the stories by Terry (and family), because, they (the Terry's) committed the crimes , the evidence was shown in courts. 'Journos' didn't have to muckrake

In the case of Terry's mum and brother, you are right AFAIK. But in Terry's dad's case you're dead wrong. It was a journo who went and asked him if he knew where he could get drugs. And then after the story was published all the evidence was given to the police.

Re: The Football Chat Thread : Sat Feb 04, 2012 1:31 am  

Roddy B wrote:

Teams rarely work without great managers. Liverpool's 2005 win was more down to Benitez than Gerrard IMO. Define; leader. If you use our '05 final as an example, who was our leader? Dudek for keeping us in it with last gasp saves? Carragher for some desperate defending? Hamann for coming on and using his experience in a time when we were being battered by our superiors? Gerrard for scoring and winning a penalty? If you look at the best teams, they often have a team of players with similar personalities, look at Barcelona, who's the leader there? Xavi? Messi? Puyol? Pique? Valdes? Iniesta? Villa? Busquets? Alves?

I don't think teams need a single 'leader', all players should be expected to lead by example. If you end up only having one leader, or a couple of leaders, you run the risk of imbalance in the side and some players having far too much influence than is actually required. If you look at Liverpool's team under Benitez, according to 'hidden knowledge', Gerrard and Carragher had far too much influence over the dressing room and the club. We need their leadership, but I'd rather my players not be influenced by others because they know their own example to set and they motivate themselves. For me, the role of captain should be given to either the perceived best player or the highest paid player, just to massage their ego. IMO, they do very little on the pitch that is believed a captain does, but hey, that's just me.

Managers are leaders btw but let's not introduce them because that's not the context of leadership we're talking about. We're talking about on the field. Now, who can give us examples of a great team that didn't have a leader. I'm sure there must be one or two and yes you don't need a leader for any team but if want to be a successful team you do. You can argue about how many leaders a team needs but the answer is always "never less than one".

Re: The Football Chat Thread : Sat Feb 04, 2012 1:47 am  

McClennan wrote:

Managers are leaders btw but let's not introduce them because that's not the context of leadership we're talking about. We're talking about on the field. Now, who can give us examples of a great team that didn't have a leader. I'm sure there must be one or two and yes you don't need a leader for any team but if want to be a successful team you do. You can argue about how many leaders a team needs but the answer is always "never less than one".

I'm arguing what effect a leader has on a pitch. People say they give players direction, but they don't. They say they inspire team mates, but I don't believe they do. Just about the only thing a captain can be good for is telling a player to calm down, or giving him a mouthful for something stupid. For me, football has become so detailed, so professional and so 'hard' that I don't believe captains stand out anymore. What us fans find inspirational, for me, doesn't translate to anything on the field. It's like pundits when they say "Gerrard took the game by the scruff of the neck" nonsense, what they mean is he dribbled with the ball or played a one-two. People now are saying Scott Parker should be captain, why? Because he tackles well? Because he works hard? Because he "leads by example"? For me, that elasticated armband wouldn't make any of England's players play any better or worse, I don't think Parker's game would change with it on, I don't think Gerrard's game changed, or Terry's, or Beckham's.

If you looked at most of Barcelona's players, they aren't leaders in the English sense. They aren't strong, massively industrious, they don't do crunching tackles or put their bodies on the line. For me, Puyol is the captain because he's the oldest and most experienced, when Barcelona are trouncing sides 5-0, I don't look and see Puyol asserting his leadership, but he's still captain. Similarly, Real Madrid have Iker Casillas as captain, as do Spain, are you telling me that, whilst Spain are out there with 65% possession, Casillas is inspiring them and leading by example?

Basically, I think the role of captain is overstated and we could appoint just about anybody and it wouldn't matter. If any of our players don't like it because they don't get inspired by him or he doesn't 'lead' them, they should dropped and never considered again for having too weak a mentality.