Re: What Do You Think Mr Carter? : Mon Sep 28, 2015 4:45 pm  

jack in the box wrote:

In all fairness to the fans the majority would have stayed well clear of some of the deals we have done regarding Cas rejects.
Many fans have been around a long time and seen it all before, in all fairness 'collectively' know far more than some people give them credit for.

They also know when they are being sold a pup and that's why more and more are staying away.

So don't blame the fans, they are the ones that care and suffer the most from the abortion they witnessed today.

Problem with MC as I see it is not the deals he’s done - I assume he takes advice from his coaching team who are clearly crap.

He’s done some good stuff especially the BV deal.

It’s his attitude and his style that bother me. I really don’t like his angry dad routine. More Importantly is his management style as I see it that worries me. As someone who’s job means he works for many companies I meet a lot of Managers and a fair few CEO’s at some of the smaller outfits. For me there are broadly speaking two kinds of managers in my experience. Reactive and pro-active.

To me MC seems very much reactive as indeed most accountants are by nature.

Here is an example of what I mean. Monies tight because of attendances dropping lower than budgeted for mid season. MC’s response - sell a good player. That’s fine in pure accountancy terms as it instantly balances the books. However IMO it’s no use to us. What I would like is a pro-active response at least first

This would be something like ‘where else can I make the shortfall before selling the family silver”. I know, a share issue, ask Squadbuilder to put on a dinner dance, come up with some sort of imaginative promotion for the fans or businesses. I can’t be exact because I’m not the CEO and perhaps there were no other options - however I firmly believe he probably never even looked because his default setting is cut cut cut and never ever speculate.

Basically not a businessman but a decent accountant - in which case we will probably always have some sort of club but not a winning one.

I could be a million miles off but it’s certainly the impression he gives off and it seems to rub off on the players who are a defeatist and negative as he seems to be. MC yes you do need to balance the books but remember this - no one ever supported a club because it's double entry book keeping was exceptional - true in most other industries it would get you brownie points but not this one so stop going on about it it's not helping - sorry.

One thing I am certain of is that he has no natural ability to engage with fans or push what little positive PR there is. His desire to foliow up a good news story with a bad one is staggering. Best performance of the year against Bradford and he spends all week chasing up a none story about abusive fans. Bloody hell Michael forget about them and push the positive - sort that one out quietly in the background. It doesn’t matter how right you are or the need to appease the RFL what matters is making people want to support the team.

I think the kindest thing I can say is that MC is probably very good at running the club day to day but is pretty poor at leading it which is a very different job.

Do I think I could do it any better?

Yes actually I do for the very reasons you suggest Prince - how much better I don’t know - but although I do have the pound required to buy it that’s where it stops.

So I live in hope that like Ted MC eventually learns the ropes, because as both you and I know it took Ted a few years to stop being mugged by every passing Aussie.

Re: What Do You Think Mr Carter? : Mon Sep 28, 2015 5:00 pm  

Vasty

One things that jumps out from your post is about the engagement with fans. Remember the audience with nights, well the arrival of Brian Smith was a huge opportunity, Cats would have been packed out for that one and the club would have made a few bob on the evening.

Re: What Do You Think Mr Carter? : Mon Sep 28, 2015 6:43 pm  

What we need to complement Mr Carter is someone with Rugby League 'nous'. Leeds have it with Caddick and Hetherington. We appeared to have it with Carter and Hetherington (Mrs) but it didn't last. One to worry about the books and one to run the rugby side to ensure we don't get our pants pulled down by every Aussie & British agent.

Re: What Do You Think Mr Carter? : Mon Sep 28, 2015 6:56 pm  

Thought that Trinity's already poor state took a downward trend when Uncle Kath went. She was good for the club during her tenure. Doubt that we would have signed Tansey and Moore if she'd still been around.

Re: What Do You Think Mr Carter? : Mon Sep 28, 2015 7:54 pm  

vastman wrote:

Problem with MC as I see it is not the deals he’s done - I assume he takes advice from his coaching team who are clearly crap.

He’s done some good stuff especially the BV deal.

It’s his attitude and his style that bother me. I really don’t like his angry dad routine. More Importantly is his management style as I see it that worries me. As someone who’s job means he works for many companies I meet a lot of Managers and a fair few CEO’s at some of the smaller outfits. For me there are broadly speaking two kinds of managers in my experience. Reactive and pro-active.

To me MC seems very much reactive as indeed most accountants are by nature.

Here is an example of what I mean. Monies tight because of attendances dropping lower than budgeted for mid season. MC’s response - sell a good player. That’s fine in pure accountancy terms as it instantly balances the books. However IMO it’s no use to us. What I would like is a pro-active response at least first

This would be something like ‘where else can I make the shortfall before selling the family silver”. I know, a share issue, ask Squadbuilder to put on a dinner dance, come up with some sort of imaginative promotion for the fans or businesses. I can’t be exact because I’m not the CEO and perhaps there were no other options - however I firmly believe he probably never even looked because his default setting is cut cut cut and never ever speculate.

Basically not a businessman but a decent accountant - in which case we will probably always have some sort of club but not a winning one.

I could be a million miles off but it’s certainly the impression he gives off and it seems to rub off on the players who are a defeatist and negative as he seems to be. MC yes you do need to balance the books but remember this - no one ever supported a club because it's double entry book keeping was exceptional - true in most other industries it would get you brownie points but not this one so stop going on about it it's not helping - sorry.

One thing I am certain of is that he has no natural ability to engage with fans or push what little positive PR there is. His desire to foliow up a good news story with a bad one is staggering. Best performance of the year against Bradford and he spends all week chasing up a none story about abusive fans. Bloody hell Michael forget about them and push the positive - sort that one out quietly in the background. It doesn’t matter how right you are or the need to appease the RFL what matters is making people want to support the team.

I think the kindest thing I can say is that MC is probably very good at running the club day to day but is pretty poor at leading it which is a very different job.

Do I think I could do it any better?

Yes actually I do for the very reasons you suggest Prince - how much better I don’t know - but although I do have the pound required to buy it that’s where it stops.

So I live in hope that like Ted MC eventually learns the ropes, because as both you and I know it took Ted a few years to stop being mugged by every passing Aussie.

can't agree with you there. there isn't a lot of difference between an accountant and a good business man. they both know that for any business to survive it has to make a profit and to be honest in any other business for someone to take on a company that was losing 700 thousand pounds per year and within 2 years make a profit of 20 000 pounds would be hailed a genius by the business community . add to that having the nuts to be able to go to the banks and tell them that he was no longer prepared to pay other peoples loans that were taken against the ground, demand and get a fair rent for BV , also succeeded in bringing in one of the worlds best coaches. the club is now in a far better position that it has been for a long, long while. for the life of me I can't see why some people seem to want to attack him at every opportunity. the on field performances have very little to do with him. he provides the players that are asked for and then leaves it to the coach and at the beginning of the season it looked like on paper that we had the best team we had had in years. I am not saying that some of the criticism isn't fair but what I am saying is constant personal attacks by the likes of pimpernel and others are not warranted and not needed .

Re: What Do You Think Mr Carter? : Mon Sep 28, 2015 8:23 pm  

well said mc has more business acumen than all the failed regimes of the last 40 years put together,mc is not letting the club down its the players if we get relagated blame them.

Re: What Do You Think Mr Carter? : Mon Sep 28, 2015 9:05 pm  

I am sorry but anyone can reduce the clubs overheads, firstly sell the merchantable playing staff, second reduce the high earners and replace all with cheaper alternatives. Then you reduce the off field staff basically follow the austerity model.
I have said before that he is responsible for the on field performance because any coach can ask for a player but it will be the Chairman who decides what we can afford based on his calculations.
He has been here two seasons and in that time we have initially quite slowly seen the club regress but in the last season this has accelerated to the position we are in now.
Some say he stood up the the BOI the problem is he did not want to stay at Belle Vue he preferred Dewsbury which confirms to me he does not understand the connection between the ground and the supporters.
In conclusion if we are relegated he is responsible just like many would have said if Ted was still in charge.

Re: What Do You Think Mr Carter? : Tue Sep 29, 2015 6:10 am  

Scarlet Pimpernell wrote:

I am sorry but anyone can reduce the clubs overheads, firstly sell the merchantable playing staff, second reduce the high earners and replace all with cheaper alternatives. Then you reduce the off field staff basically follow the austerity model.
I have said before that he is responsible for the on field performance because any coach can ask for a player but it will be the Chairman who decides what we can afford based on his calculations.
He has been here two seasons and in that time we have initially quite slowly seen the club regress but in the last season this has accelerated to the position we are in now.
Some say he stood up the the BOI the problem is he did not want to stay at Belle Vue he preferred Dewsbury which confirms to me he does not understand the connection between the ground and the supporters.
In conclusion if we are relegated he is responsible just like many would have said if Ted was still in charge.

you won't let go of that stadium issue even though he's probably given the club a life line whether they stay in SL or not, fans are going on emotions than what's the good direct for the the club
also you can't hold him responsible for the actions of players on and off the field, all these players have under performed and will be lucky to get a contact in SL if we drop

Re: What Do You Think Mr Carter? : Tue Sep 29, 2015 6:57 am  

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Re: What Do You Think Mr Carter? : Tue Sep 29, 2015 6:57 am  

MC and his partner CB saved our club. He has invested (loaned, I believe but good luck with that one!) a considerable amount of money. So, my thanks for that!
He has probably let himself down by interacting with some fans on social media sites, often the sewers of modern society!
The bloke is obviously passionate about his involvement with the club and I am in no doubt he is as sick as us about the players performances.
He is the gaffer so the buck stops with him but some contributors go too far in their personal attacks on him - then again it's easy to do anonymously isn't it.