Re: Ottawa aces : Sun Oct 24, 2021 12:00 pm  

cosmicat wrote:

I’ve got family in South Wales interest in rugby league is nil

Nil in your family perhaps but not in the general public. Nobody in my family except for me and my son have any interest in Trinity, that doesn’t mean others aren’t, poor argument.

I’m not saying it’s mainstream anymore and certainly not comparable with RU or football but SKY viewing figures suggest it’s well watched in that region.

However you’re missing the point and I don’t know how because I’ve made it clear enough. I didn’t say there was a SL team ready and waiting. What I said was that there is an amateur game and some interest. The RL should have built on that over the last 20 years but have failed to do so, yet imho wasted time and effort on a far less viable effort in Canada.

It may well be too late in Wales now, maybe not, but one thing I’m certain of is that it was never ever on In Canada right from the start.

Re: Ottawa aces : Mon Oct 25, 2021 7:12 am  

The North Wales Crusaders have a decent following and are more competitive than west wales in League 1, would probs be best to push them rather than a non existent side in a RU stronghold area

Re: Ottawa aces : Mon Oct 25, 2021 8:43 am  

financialtimes wrote:

The North Wales Crusaders have a decent following and are more competitive than west wales in League 1, would probs be best to push them rather than a non existent side in a RU stronghold area

I'm not sure why you need the crazy bit, very silly.

Yes, it's a fair point and you may be right regarding the region based on the current situation.

Again though that wasn't my original point. The point is that in 1995 there was a great interest in RL in South Wales at the time. South Wales is the population HUB of the nation so that's where the money and the fans were and still are. So financially that's the area to go for.

I don't get the RU bit. There is no reason why RL cannot pick up RU players who are disaffected with the sport, fancy a change, want to play a bit of both, are more suited to RL, it's a ready-made talent pool. Also, it's not like it used to be, no Welsh team sees RL as a threat anymore, not even a SL team, if anything some would want a piece of the action.

It's all speculation anyway as we don't have the cash to start a team in my back yard.,

Re: Ottawa aces : Mon Oct 25, 2021 9:27 am  

vastman wrote:

I'm not sure why you need the crazy bit, very silly.

Because it's crazy to try infiltrate an area with no RL presence which is already a RU stronghold area

vastman wrote:

Again though that wasn't my original point. The point is that in 1995 there was a great interest in RL in South Wales at the time. South Wales is the population HUB of the nation so that's where the money and the fans were and still are. So financially that's the area to go for.

So as there was some interest 26 years ago, your logic says there will still be interest
As for "that's where the money is", have you been to newport/swansea/cardif/bridgened recently? any idea what was the main industries and employers were in these areas, coal and steel.

vastman wrote:

I don't get the RU bit. There is no reason why RL cannot pick up RU players who are disaffected with the sport, fancy a change, want to play a bit of both, are more suited to RL, it's a ready-made talent pool. Also, it's not like it used to be, no Welsh team sees RL as a threat anymore, not even a SL team, if anything some would want a piece of the action.
It's all speculation anyway as we don't have the cash to start a team in my back yard.,

Hopefully I've explained the
Plenty of reasons, let alone your final sentence that really puts the stops on it happening.

Re: Ottawa aces : Mon Oct 25, 2021 10:18 am  

financialtimes wrote:

Because it's crazy to try infiltrate an area with no RL presence which is already a RU stronghold area

So as there was some interest 26 years ago, your logic says there will still be interest
As for "that's where the money is", have you been to newport/swansea/cardif/bridgened recently? any idea what was the main industries and employers were in these areas, coal and steel.


Hopefully I've explained the
Plenty of reasons, let alone your final sentence that really puts the stops on it happening.

No, it doesn't to be honest as you seem to be missing the point on purpose, I have to wonder why.

I'm talking historically, what part of that don't you get? You're normally pretty smart and reasonable.

The money should have been poured in years ago, I agree it's probably a lost cause now or certainly far more difficult. My aim would now be for the RFL to support a strong amateur league in South Wales as well as the rest of Wales and look eventually to produce a sustainable team at Div one level for both North and South Wales. Any higher than that would require a Sugar Daddy with very deep pockets and I don't know many of those.

By the way, any idea what the main industries anywhere were 26 years ago almost anywhere RL is played The fact remains South Wales is the population HUB of the Principality. Hence that is where the money is it's simple economics, whether we can mine that is a different matter. The economy of South Wales is actually doing ok by the way, especially around Cardiff and Swansea and that's where I'm talking about.

The main reason for me picking out Wales as opposed to Sheffield and Newcastle which are clubs near to the heartland is the international slant. Wales at present can barely put a team out, certainly not one with many Welsh men in it. I don't for one minute believe that a South Wales club would provide the talent to take on the Aussies as in the 1990s but at least it could be an honest Wesh team with some credibility.

I holiday in North Wales on a regular basis and it's empty, that's what makes it so nice, there is nowhere near the population base to support a pro-RL team as has already been proved!

But for the sake of peace and harmony I'll agree with the last bit, there is no fecking money, that was wasted years ago.

Re: Ottawa aces : Mon Oct 25, 2021 3:51 pm  

vastman wrote:

No, it doesn't to be honest as you seem to be missing the point on purpose, I have to wonder why.

I'm talking historically, what part of that don't you get? You're normally pretty smart and reasonable.

The money should have been poured in years ago, I agree it's probably a lost cause now or certainly far more difficult. My aim would now be for the RFL to support a strong amateur league in South Wales as well as the rest of Wales and look eventually to produce a sustainable team at Div one level for both North and South Wales. Any higher than that would require a Sugar Daddy with very deep pockets and I don't know many of those.

By the way, any idea what the main industries anywhere were 26 years ago almost anywhere RL is played The fact remains South Wales is the population HUB of the Principality. Hence that is where the money is it's simple economics, whether we can mine that is a different matter. The economy of South Wales is actually doing ok by the way, especially around Cardiff and Swansea and that's where I'm talking about.

The main reason for me picking out Wales as opposed to Sheffield and Newcastle which are clubs near to the heartland is the international slant. Wales at present can barely put a team out, certainly not one with many Welsh men in it. I don't for one minute believe that a South Wales club would provide the talent to take on the Aussies as in the 1990s but at least it could be an honest Wesh team with some credibility.

I holiday in North Wales on a regular basis and it's empty, that's what makes it so nice, there is nowhere near the population base to support a pro-RL team as has already been proved!

But for the sake of peace and harmony I'll agree with the last bit, there is no fecking money, that was wasted years ago.

I thought you'd suggested it should happen now and that south wales is where the money is, I must have miss-read your post, apologies

The difference with south wales industry and the M62 corridor is that mining & engineering have been replaced with other employment, such as warehousing and call centres

North Wales Crusaders play out of Rhyl, the club lay on subsidised travel from Wrexham for supporters on match days, 2021 season they have averaged around 600 for home games, having been to many league 1 fixtures this year, I can tell you that's not bad support for that league, definitely something to build on.

Re: Ottawa aces : Tue Oct 26, 2021 6:33 am  

Ottawa as a Canadian based club is a dead duck.
I would love RL to take off in a new territory but, after the Toronto debacle and with less cash in the domestic game, the very thought of any club being based over there and competing in "our" comp is utterly ridiculous.
If someone over there has heaps of cash to burn, why dont they try and grow from the low base that already exists ?

As for Wales, that boat mat have sailed but, if there is a (very) wealthy backer, it could work.
However, it would need to be under some kind of franchise type system.

Re: Ottawa aces : Tue Oct 26, 2021 7:55 am  

wrencat1873 wrote:

Ottawa as a Canadian based club is a dead duck.
I would love RL to take off in a new territory but, after the Toronto debacle and with less cash in the domestic game, the very thought of any club being based over there and competing in "our" comp is utterly ridiculous.
If someone over there has heaps of cash to burn, why dont they try and grow from the low base that already exists ?

As for Wales, that boat mat have sailed but, if there is a (very) wealthy backer, it could work.
However, it would need to be under some kind of franchise type system.

That was all I was saying, at last someone got it.

It's possible and it's more possible than Toronto or Ottawa but it's still highly unlikely.

The only growth teams I can see on the horizon are Newcastle and more of a revitalisation York and Sheffield. If we could get those three up and running in a big way that's 3 cities added to the list. It seems so obvious to me and so achievable!

Sheffield in particular now has a new home, modest for now but actually designed to be expanded as required. They are in the schools, have local amateur teams and can also serve Barnsley and Rotherham, even with the number of football teams that's a huge catchment area. It's a no brainer to me.

Re: Ottawa aces : Tue Oct 26, 2021 9:01 am  

Tbf to Toronto the fan base is there but it needs long term foundations not 2 years and thrown into super league

Re: Ottawa aces : Tue Oct 26, 2021 9:16 am  

cosmicat wrote:

Tbf to Toronto the fan base is there but it needs long term foundations not 2 years and thrown into super league

Has it?

Seeing as entry was hugely subsidised and I believe free on occasions then I don't really think you can call that a genuine fan base?

I'm not knocking it as such, it was probably the right way to do it in that regard but there was a lot of smoke and mirrors involved. How well they would fair under real market conditions remains unanswered.

However what cannot be denied is that they were effectively a circus act, they had virtually no homegrown players and more importantly no way to produce them. There was no way a club that needed to ship its entire playing staff in from overseas had any long term future.