[PopTart]

Re: Innes Senior : Wed Aug 19, 2020 9:42 pm  

Alchemist1 wrote:

If you never play the likes of greensmith you will never know how good they are some dont develop until later in their 20s others like andy farrell could play in any team at 16 its just how they progress and develop but if they are never thrown in the deep end how do you know if they can swim?

Throwing them in the deep end is a sure fire way if killing your kids.
You develop them and bring them in when they are ready.

I like Croft a lot but he needs time develop and occasional games.
Apart from Catalan you wouldn't drop Lyne or Tupou for either of the young ones, especially if it's only to give them a game.

Re: Innes Senior : Wed Aug 19, 2020 10:09 pm  

PopTart wrote:

Throwing them in the deep end is a sure fire way if killing your kids.
You develop them and bring them in when they are ready.

I like Croft a lot but he needs time develop and occasional games.
Apart from Catalan you wouldn't drop Lyne or Tupou for either of the young ones, especially if it's only to give them a game.

do you not admire how other clubs bring in the young uns, take cas for instance they had no problems in bring in Trueman and Milner in pivotal roles, it didn't kill them off

No reason this season for us to do the same

Re: Innes Senior : Wed Aug 19, 2020 10:17 pm  

Greensmith is a centre. I think most people would agree he is behind Atkins and Croft in the pecking order. His time will come. It was a winger we desperately needed due to injuries. Putting Greensmith on the wing would be detrimental to his confidence. Look at Croft when he was played out of position on the right wing, or indeed Atkins first game of the season.

Re: Innes Senior : Wed Aug 19, 2020 11:09 pm  

TrinityDave wrote:

Greensmith is a centre. I think most people would agree he is behind Atkins and Croft in the pecking order. His time will come. It was a winger we desperately needed due to injuries. Putting Greensmith on the wing would be detrimental to his confidence. Look at Croft when he was played out of position on the right wing, or indeed Atkins first game of the season.

If you was placing him in the pack and facing impacts I could understand it but come on how the hell are they going to learn

Re: Innes Senior : Thu Aug 20, 2020 5:52 am  

OK As his dad I’m going to sound bias, played in an unbeatable junior side that didn’t lose a game for almost 3 years, 2 yorkshire cups, 3 league 1 titles and 2 YJARL challenge cups, at 16 he represented Yorkshire U17’s and at 17 represented Yorkshire U19’s and also represented England U18’s community lions, was picked up by Wakey at 17 when playing for PONTE college v Wakefield college (basically the academy side) and ripped them apart, he’s the same age as senior and is also 6ft 4in not a natural winger but can play there and better than other centres played out of position. Last years CC game v Saints saw the debut of Jack Croft, not sure this is any more of a pressure game than that.

Re: Innes Senior : Thu Aug 20, 2020 6:47 am  

financialtimes wrote:

OK As his dad I’m going to sound bias, played in an unbeatable junior side that didn’t lose a game for almost 3 years, 2 yorkshire cups, 3 league 1 titles and 2 YJARL challenge cups, at 16 he represented Yorkshire U17’s and at 17 represented Yorkshire U19’s and also represented England U18’s community lions, was picked up by Wakey at 17 when playing for PONTE college v Wakefield college (basically the academy side) and ripped them apart, he’s the same age as senior and is also 6ft 4in not a natural winger but can play there and better than other centres played out of position. Last years CC game v Saints saw the debut of Jack Croft, not sure this is any more of a pressure game than that.

Very frustrating pal told my lad you need to try and take the emotion out of playing for your home club, I think it shows a lack of faith in our own academy if your going to bring in others from other clubs whats the point in doing one

Re: Innes Senior : Thu Aug 20, 2020 7:30 am  

financialtimes wrote:

OK As his dad I’m going to sound bias, played in an unbeatable junior side that didn’t lose a game for almost 3 years, 2 yorkshire cups, 3 league 1 titles and 2 YJARL challenge cups, at 16 he represented Yorkshire U17’s and at 17 represented Yorkshire U19’s and also represented England U18’s community lions, was picked up by Wakey at 17 when playing for PONTE college v Wakefield college (basically the academy side) and ripped them apart, he’s the same age as senior and is also 6ft 4in not a natural winger but can play there and better than other centres played out of position. Last years CC game v Saints saw the debut of Jack Croft, not sure this is any more of a pressure game than that.

with due respect the achievements you list mean nothing they are memories from the pop and crisp league. Il give your lad some advice here if he thinks he’s hard some to or things arnt going his way then make them go his way.
Work at his fitness and get as strong and fast as possible and conditioned to last the full 80 and he must work endlessly on his own at his game, trust no one but his family and don’t trust anyone involved in the game, 90 per cent of people in the game can’t lay In bed straight and are not interested. If your after favours from Chester you’ll get none and it’s the same at other clubs he’s only interested in his job. The bitterest pill is hard to swallow, don’t let anyone take it away , single minded and determination

Re: Innes Senior : Thu Aug 20, 2020 7:33 am  

I say throw a few of kids in cant possibly do any worse than last weekends shenanigans agree might knock confidence a bit but playing in a team that has only won 4 or 5 in last 25 is not exactly a team full of confidence anyway but the experience it will bring will certainly help them

Re: Innes Senior : Thu Aug 20, 2020 7:51 am  

snowie wrote:

do you not admire how other clubs bring in the young uns, take cas for instance they had no problems in bring in Trueman and Milner in pivotal roles, it didn't kill them off

No reason this season for us to do the same

Because they are not the same. Define what you mean by young.

Take Greensmith as an example. He is young, seriously young but more importantly he has little experience. I may be wrong but he hasn’t got any rep appearances . either. He hasn’t even been out in dual reg yet??

Now I’m with you in that we leave it far too long on some cases but not these.

These Cas or Wigan youngsters are usually a year older than Greensmith and have done some time in the lower leagues.

Now for the controversial bit, Cas spend big on youth and we simply don’t because we can’t. So let’s be honest we get the best of the rest, it’s a fact. Luckily some of those are either late developers physically or better still just missed going to a top academy. It’s a credit to all that we produce what we do, someone at the club has an eye for latent talent.

You look at any Trinity TV game featuring the U19’s. There is one v Cas and although we do well just look at the physicality of the teams. Cas look bigger, stronger and older. They are men and we look like boys.

Ability wise we are probably fairly close but physically they are far more ready than us.

There is a reason Cas and Leeds hoover up the big lads. They don’t expect all to make it but those who do will be ready quickly and the others? Well at least they won’t be with us.

I know Greensmith is a big lad but he also has a boyish face. He’s not there yet, when he is we will know. I realise a boyish farce is hardly scientific or right every time but I reckon you get my drift.

Greensmith and Aydin would be destroyed are the moment imho. Bailey maybe, HBs are different. Gwaze, Walker and Croft at a pinch are the only ones.

TJ was special from the start. Jowitt and Crowther were both under age reps but above all most came into a team on the up not on the way down. Not massive but still crucial.

It’s tragic we have no A team or DR to get them ready but if we had that’s where they would be for me.

Sorry if I’ve upset anyone but I have no vested interest either way, just 50 years in and around the game and that’s how I see it. Apologies for any factual errors.

Re: Innes Senior : Thu Aug 20, 2020 8:14 am  

MOPSEY LIVES ON wrote:

with due respect the achievements you list mean nothing they are memories from the pop and crisp league. Il give your lad some advice here if he thinks he’s hard some to or things arnt going his way then make them go his way.
Work at his fitness and get as strong and fast as possible and conditioned to last the full 80 and he must work endlessly on his own at his game, trust no one but his family and don’t trust anyone involved in the game, 90 per cent of people in the game can’t lay In bed straight and are not interested. If your after favours from Chester you’ll get none and it’s the same at other clubs he’s only interested in his job. The bitterest pill is hard to swallow, don’t let anyone take it away , single minded and determination

I agree with all you say100% and I’m no novice and I’ve been telling him exactly the same as you say for the last 2 years.
He’s been one of the stand out players in his time in the academy, one that teams changed their strategy to play against him, even in the reserves. As when he was a junior the work he does whilst playing makes others look good. He training every day, weights and running he’s got the fitness to last and the physique to make an impact, it’s just very frustrating when he’s being held on furlough to “save money” but there have been 2 signings and a loan deal come in instead.
In any business model not backing your investment is long term commercial suicide, I know this is sport but it’s still a business