Re: Andy Ellis : Tue Sep 25, 2012 4:05 pm  

Theboyem wrote:

Don't see any point at all in getting rid of Ellis and signing McShane. And Murrell isn't a hooker at any level. Guess we will just go with Aiton, Wood & Wildie. Washbrook can cover there in an emergency as he did for Hull.

Just to clarify, I'm not saying Murrell is a hooker but he can and has done in the past, a job if required. In a similar fashion to Danny Washbrook. This is a 4th choice hooker we are talking not a starter.

Re: Andy Ellis : Tue Sep 25, 2012 4:21 pm  

deeHell wrote:

For me Aiton, Wood and Ellis are all up to the job for us, but is having 3 decent hookers a luxury we can afford? I have every faith in Matty Wilde stepping in when needed providing adequate cover. He played a lot of first team rugby in 2011 and I thought he had the potential to kick on. This year he should get his chance and I don’t think he’ll let us down. He must have impressed the coaching team enough to have faith in him as back up. Use the money to strengthen elsewhere.

Far too reasonable for some people on here.

Re: Andy Ellis : Tue Sep 25, 2012 4:27 pm  

Got to be more to Ellis going than meets the eye. Hooker is a crucial position and Ellis proved that he was the best hooker at the club, he got our forwards on the front foot, his pass was fantastic ( like watching Brad Drew ) , he moved forward engaging defenders before passing, he gets passed the markers running straight and got us quick plays. He was the answer. Aiton is just not a hooker, his pass is slow, he just passes rather than moving forward and passing, he runs sideways, he is a great tackler but you need more than that from your hooker. We won games when Ellis played, our forwards looked good when Ellis played, Tim Smith looked great when Ellis played. Tim Smith was average playing with Aiton and our forward were often second best. Four hookers is to many to have in the squad, I would have played Ellis with Wildie as his back up, Wood would be my cover for injury. I just don`t know about Aiton , Impact back row sub.

Re: Andy Ellis : Tue Sep 25, 2012 4:36 pm  

At last belly someone who can put 2 and 2 and come up with 4.Andy was by far the best hooker at the club, and the play the ball area improved 100%
A BIG LOSS IN MY VIEW

Re: Andy Ellis : Tue Sep 25, 2012 4:50 pm  

lampyboy wrote:

At last belly someone who can put 2 and 2 and come up with 4.Andy was by far the best hooker at the club, and the play the ball area improved 100%
A BIG LOSS IN MY VIEW

What do you mean at last, there's a fair few people on this thread lamenting his departure.

Re: Andy Ellis : Tue Sep 25, 2012 5:36 pm  

I don't think this reflects too badly on Andy Ellis.
The club has a limited budget below the salary cap. Tough decisions have to be made to build the strongest squad possible within that budget.
Players are valued on their contribution in relation to cost.
I have no idea about individual salaries, but I would suggest Aiton and Ellis were on more than Wood and certainly Wildie.
So say Aiton and Ellis cost 3 salary cap points, Wood 2 and Wildie 1.
We need a starting hooker, replacement and back-up. What's the most efficient way of having this. Maybe fans would like Aiton, Ellis and Wood, but that would be 8 points and without injuries, one of them wouldn't play. As it is Aiton, Wood and Wildie would only be 6 points, leaving 2 points to be used elsewhere in the squad.
If other clubs have 100 salary cap points, we only have 80. If we use up points on back-up players, it reduces the amount spent on the first team squad. The loss of under 20s rugby will drastically reduce the number of back-up players.
To me the right combination is to have one established player, one almost there and one developing. Two established players would be a luxury for a club on limited salary cap. The decision then lies between Aiton or Ellis and that's down to coach's preference.
Good luck to Andy Ellis. He is a good SL standard 'hooker'. Suprising that he's gone to Fev, but they are very ambitious at the moment and maybe they made the best offer.

Re: Andy Ellis : Tue Sep 25, 2012 5:58 pm  

coco the fullback wrote:

I don't think this reflects too badly on Andy Ellis.
The club has a limited budget below the salary cap. Tough decisions have to be made to build the strongest squad possible within that budget.
Players are valued on their contribution in relation to cost.
I have no idea about individual salaries, but I would suggest Aiton and Ellis were on more than Wood and certainly Wildie.
So say Aiton and Ellis cost 3 salary cap points, Wood 2 and Wildie 1.
We need a starting hooker, replacement and back-up. What's the most efficient way of having this. Maybe fans would like Aiton, Ellis and Wood, but that would be 8 points and without injuries, one of them wouldn't play. As it is Aiton, Wood and Wildie would only be 6 points, leaving 2 points to be used elsewhere in the squad.
If other clubs have 100 salary cap points, we only have 80. If we use up points on back-up players, it reduces the amount spent on the first team squad. The loss of under 20s rugby will drastically reduce the number of back-up players.
To me the right combination is to have one established player, one almost there and one developing. Two established players would be a luxury for a club on limited salary cap. The decision then lies between Aiton or Ellis and that's down to coach's preference.
Good luck to Andy Ellis. He is a good SL standard 'hooker'. Suprising that he's gone to Fev, but they are very ambitious at the moment and maybe they made the best offer.

Agree, we can't have our cake and eat it, we want to strengthen in other areas so something had to give and Ellis being one of our top earners was it. People are moaning about this move but I bet there would be more moans if we couldn't sign a couple of props because we can't afford it.

Re: Andy Ellis : Tue Sep 25, 2012 6:03 pm  

Firstly let me say I'm very disappointed that Andy Ellis has left the Club and I think the Club has make a mistake. Having said that I'm struggling with the "all our improvement" is down to his inclusion. I have to agree Andy is an excellent hooker and his distribution is first class but let me ask a question. Its a genuine question and not intended to be contraversial.

We won our last 7 league games with Andy at hooker. That's 560 minutes of rugby. From my recollections Andy was substituted before half time in most of the games if not all of them. Therefore Andy played less than 50% of the 560 minutes but we managed to win those games therefore who was "distributing", "bringing on the forwards" when he was off.

Genuine question but I think there is more than one man responsible for the improvement.

Re: Andy Ellis : Tue Sep 25, 2012 6:59 pm  

deeHell wrote:

For me Aiton, Wood and Ellis are all up to the job for us, but is having 3 decent hookers a luxury we can afford? I have every faith in Matty Wilde stepping in when needed providing adequate cover. He played a lot of first team rugby in 2011 and I thought he had the potential to kick on. This year he should get his chance and I don’t think he’ll let us down. He must have impressed the coaching team enough to have faith in him as back up. Use the money to strengthen elsewhere.

Agree 100% with this!!! i thought he was doing a good job in the 2011 season with James Davy and Rinaldi and was suprised when we got wood to play the sub hooker as i thought this would be the season when we saw both James and Matty coming through more.

Re: Andy Ellis : Wed Sep 26, 2012 9:04 am  

bellycouldtackle wrote:

Got to be more to Ellis going than meets the eye. Hooker is a crucial position and Ellis proved that he was the best hooker at the club, he got our forwards on the front foot, his pass was fantastic ( like watching Brad Drew ) , he moved forward engaging defenders before passing, he gets passed the markers running straight and got us quick plays. He was the answer. Aiton is just not a hooker, his pass is slow, he just passes rather than moving forward and passing, he runs sideways, he is a great tackler but you need more than that from your hooker. We won games when Ellis played, our forwards looked good when Ellis played, Tim Smith looked great when Ellis played. Tim Smith was average playing with Aiton and our forward were often second best. Four hookers is to many to have in the squad, I would have played Ellis with Wildie as his back up, Wood would be my cover for injury. I just don`t know about Aiton , Impact back row sub.

...agree 100% mate !!!