Re: OT wakefield to go blue : Sat Dec 14, 2019 10:37 pm  

King Street Cat wrote:

Wow! Johnson has had a majority for barely 48 hours, and already people are calling for a return of the death penalty.

This is the very populism streak in the working classes that the far right tap into so very well. Forget how bad or otherwise Corbyn is, the fact that huge swathes of average Joes (of which I am one) can somehow think that the best bet for the next 5 years is the Tory party, after literally butchering the social fabric and structures they rely upon (via 'austerity') for the last 9 years, is incomprehensible to me. Don't try and get your head around it you'll drive yourself nuts.

Re: OT wakefield to go blue : Sat Dec 14, 2019 10:38 pm  

Yes some people fall for things on buses and others fall for left wing propaganda

Re: OT wakefield to go blue : Sat Dec 14, 2019 10:49 pm  

The Ghost of '99 wrote: This is literally the lie that will never die. I should be amazed that people still believe the stuff on the side of the bus after all these years but sadly it's still out there. I don't know about 16 billion a year but 'the ONS reports that the UK government's net contribution to the EU – that is, the difference between the money it paid to the EU and the money it received – was £11.0 billion in 2018 compared with the £20.0 billion theoretical liability. ' https://www.ons.gov.uk/economy/governmentpublicsectorandtaxes/publicsectorfinance/articles/theukcontributiontotheeubudget/2017-10-31 Or to use another website like Fullfact they have it at 9 million a year we contribute. https://fullfact.org/europe/our-eu-membership-fee-55-million/ As they say It’s been claimed that we send £350 million a week to the EU. That misses out the rebate, and it doesn’t represent the total economic costs and benefits of EU membership to the UK. £350 million is roughly what we would pay to the EU budget without the rebate. The UK actually paid closer to £250 million a week. So maybe not what EW said but a whichever way you look at it a fair crack.

The Ghost of '99 wrote: This is literally the lie that will never die. I should be amazed that people still believe the stuff on the side of the bus after all these years but sadly it's still out there. I don't know about 16 billion a year but 'the ONS reports that the UK government's net contribution to the EU – that is, the difference between the money it paid to the EU and the money it received – was £11.0 billion in 2018 compared with the £20.0 billion theoretical liability. ' https://www.ons.gov.uk/economy/governmentpublicsectorandtaxes/publicsectorfinance/articles/theukcontributiontotheeubudget/2017-10-31 Or to use another website like Fullfact they have it at 9 million a year we contribute. https://fullfact.org/europe/our-eu-membership-fee-55-million/ As they say It’s been claimed that we send £350 million a week to the EU. That misses out the rebate, and it doesn’t represent the total economic costs and benefits of EU membership to the UK. £350 million is roughly what we would pay to the EU budget without the rebate. The UK actually paid closer to £250 million a week. So maybe not what EW said but a whichever way you look at it a fair crack.

Re: OT wakefield to go blue : Sat Dec 14, 2019 11:06 pm  

Shifty Cat wrote: I don't know about 16 billion a year but 'the ONS reports that the UK government's net contribution to the EU – that is, the difference between the money it paid to the EU and the money it received – was £11.0 billion in 2018 compared with the £20.0 billion theoretical liability. ' https://www.ons.gov.uk/economy/governmentpublicsectorandtaxes/publicsectorfinance/articles/theukcontributiontotheeubudget/2017-10-31 Or to use another website like Fullfact they have it at 9 million a year we contribute. https://fullfact.org/europe/our-eu-membership-fee-55-million/ As they say So maybe not what EW said but a whichever way you look at it a fair crack. The question also has to be asked, even if we do pay in all this extra and will thus have a saving, who the F in their right mind thinks it will be spent on the working classes or the services predominantly used by them?! And if people think the EU nationals are gonna have to leave most of em will be able to apply for settled status anyway. Not to mention most immigration still comes from outside the EU anyway. Can't wait for the huge difference we'll see when we finally 'get Brexit done' P.S - excellent post on the death penalty SC

Shifty Cat wrote: I don't know about 16 billion a year but 'the ONS reports that the UK government's net contribution to the EU – that is, the difference between the money it paid to the EU and the money it received – was £11.0 billion in 2018 compared with the £20.0 billion theoretical liability. ' https://www.ons.gov.uk/economy/governmentpublicsectorandtaxes/publicsectorfinance/articles/theukcontributiontotheeubudget/2017-10-31 Or to use another website like Fullfact they have it at 9 million a year we contribute. https://fullfact.org/europe/our-eu-membership-fee-55-million/ As they say So maybe not what EW said but a whichever way you look at it a fair crack. The question also has to be asked, even if we do pay in all this extra and will thus have a saving, who the F in their right mind thinks it will be spent on the working classes or the services predominantly used by them?! And if people think the EU nationals are gonna have to leave most of em will be able to apply for settled status anyway. Not to mention most immigration still comes from outside the EU anyway. Can't wait for the huge difference we'll see when we finally 'get Brexit done' P.S - excellent post on the death penalty SC

Re: OT wakefield to go blue : Sat Dec 14, 2019 11:09 pm  

What I do find unbelievable is that the Tories give us 10+ years of austerity, then blame the immigrants and us this to suggest that we leave the EU and over half of the country dances to their tune.
If there had been sufficient funding for education and the NHS etc, nobody would have batted an eyelid but, "we" have been squeezed like never before and e are trusting the very people that have denied benefits to the disabled and terminally ill to put things right

Having said that, labour were a shambles and should have knocked the Tories off the political map but failed miserably - it's bloody depressing.
One thing Boris Johnson isn't, is a man of the people - never has been and never will be and when you look at who is sitting next to him round the cabinet table (Rees Mogg and Pritti Patel etc) God help us.
The ecconomy is already flat lining and "we" think they are going to spend money up North, it's embarrassing.

This is the same party that has already tried to kill off industry in Yorkshire in the 80's

They do say, be careful what you wish for.

Re: OT wakefield to go blue : Sat Dec 14, 2019 11:13 pm  

roverman wrote:

Yes some people fall for things on buses and others fall for left wing propaganda

All true, but you only need a computer and a bit of time and the want to truly learn & educate yourself on things , however left or right you may be.


Personally just about everyone one I know except for a few far lefties, fall pretty much dead Centre, probably like most of the country when it generally comes to how we want our country to work and be perceived by others. That is most people support socialised medicine via the NHS and want those in genuine need through no fault of their own to be helped by the government. They don’t support ill-judged military meddling in the affairs of others. They believe in fair play and warmly welcome legal immigrants who want to become British and contribute to society. They don’t mind their taxes being spent on the deserving. Unless I'm misjudging people & without getting too deep, that's what most people want.

Re: OT wakefield to go blue : Sat Dec 14, 2019 11:20 pm  

wrencat1873 wrote: What I do find unbelievable is that the Tories give us 10+ years of austerity, then blame the immigrants and us this to suggest that we leave the EU and over half of the country dances to their tune. If there had been sufficient funding for education and the NHS etc, nobody would have batted an eyelid but, "we" have been squeezed like never before and e are trusting the very people that have denied benefits to the disabled and terminally ill to put things right Having said that, labour were a shambles and should have knocked the Tories off the political map but failed miserably - it's bloody depressing. One thing Boris Johnson isn't, is a man of the people - never has been and never will be and when you look at who is sitting next to him round the cabinet table (Rees Mogg and Pritti Patel etc) God help us. The ecconomy is already flat lining and "we" think they are going to spend money up North, it's embarrassing. This is the same party that has already tried to kill off industry in Yorkshire in the 80's They do say, be careful what you wish for. Well if he doesn't keep to at least some of his promises, especially up North. I can't see as many people being fooled again, cue The Who song, Won't Get Fooled Again...... https://www.theguardian.com/politics/2019/dec/14/boris-johnson-plans-to-go-on-spending-spree-in-north

wrencat1873 wrote: What I do find unbelievable is that the Tories give us 10+ years of austerity, then blame the immigrants and us this to suggest that we leave the EU and over half of the country dances to their tune. If there had been sufficient funding for education and the NHS etc, nobody would have batted an eyelid but, "we" have been squeezed like never before and e are trusting the very people that have denied benefits to the disabled and terminally ill to put things right Having said that, labour were a shambles and should have knocked the Tories off the political map but failed miserably - it's bloody depressing. One thing Boris Johnson isn't, is a man of the people - never has been and never will be and when you look at who is sitting next to him round the cabinet table (Rees Mogg and Pritti Patel etc) God help us. The ecconomy is already flat lining and "we" think they are going to spend money up North, it's embarrassing. This is the same party that has already tried to kill off industry in Yorkshire in the 80's They do say, be careful what you wish for. Well if he doesn't keep to at least some of his promises, especially up North. I can't see as many people being fooled again, cue The Who song, Won't Get Fooled Again...... https://www.theguardian.com/politics/2019/dec/14/boris-johnson-plans-to-go-on-spending-spree-in-north

Re: OT wakefield to go blue : Sat Dec 14, 2019 11:20 pm  

IMO Labour have only themselves to blame. Corbyn was too wishy washy on certain matters and the people of Wakefield were clearly fed up with Creagh and Cooper going against their constituents on Brexit. Personally I was torn on Corbyn, he was more articulate and intelligent then Johnson who hid in a fridge to avoid an interview, but at the same time I was concerned at his idea that terrorist prisoners should be rehabilitated and not deported (or better yet shot).

Re: OT wakefield to go blue : Sat Dec 14, 2019 11:20 pm  

Schunter wrote:

The question also has to be asked, even if we do pay in all this extra and will thus have a saving, who the F in their right mind thinks it will be spent on the working classes or the services predominantly used by them?! And if people think the EU nationals are gonna have to leave most of em will be able to apply for settled status anyway. Not to mention most immigration still comes from outside the EU anyway. Can't wait of all huge difference we'll see when we finally 'get Brexit done'

P.S - excellent post on the death penalty SC

Re: OT wakefield to go blue : Sat Dec 14, 2019 11:30 pm  

Scarlet Pimpernell wrote:

The death penalty are you mad, even some of the states in the USA are removing it from their statute because it does not work. How many have been released because of miscarriages of justice meaning they were innocent. I suppose these cases would probably not be reopened because it’s a little tricky to bring someone back from the dead.
What next we revisit the introduction of workhouses like one of their new MP’s suggested. Why not bring back fox hunting, I fear for any of the minorities who are going to face an increase in prejudice that some of our fellow citizens believe Brexit allows them.

Miscarriages of justice some are so clear cut they shouldn't breath oxygen, had the police not disposed of the London attacker we would of just give a cell to other waste of life, it's time the law was tougher

And no I'm not a conservative