Re: Room for manoeuvre. : Fri Sep 18, 2020 12:47 pm  

PopTart wrote:

Selling our best players is just a signpost to second division.
We need to keep the team together, trim the fat and get an organiser in to run the show on the field.

and if we can keep them we should but what if selling TJ was the only way we could afford to sign a very high quality half back, someone better than Sezer, maybe Foran or Cherry Evans (I know I’m dreaming but trying to make a point).

Re: Room for manoeuvre. : Fri Sep 18, 2020 12:51 pm  

The Avenger wrote:

Read the post and you’ll know it was a hypothetical example!

Loan players still need paying, let him go don’t replace him, add that wage to the other saved wages and let a new coach decide where to spend it. It’s not hard to understand that.

Let’s advertise the job and see who reply’s, maybe approach Anthony Griffin the former Penrith coach who was on the shortlist for the St George and Brisbane Head Coaches job. He has a 58% winning record in the NRL with unfancied squads of players.

We might be shocked at who become a possibility if/when the job becomes available!

Griffin got the Dragons job.

My personal choice would be the Ward/ Langley combo from London. Along with Poching that would be a pretty decent coaching set up. If they wanted to bring their conditioning team with them as well then great, London looked one of the fittest teams around last year.

Re: Room for manoeuvre. : Fri Sep 18, 2020 1:01 pm  

BarnsleyGull wrote:

Why Joe???
Also Tangata is on loan.
And whose going to be the new coach?

Avenger is spot on. Sort the coach first.

The front runners amongst the coaching candidates from these shores, if available (big question mark), have to be Danny Ward, James Ford and, more unlikely, John Kear.

If none of the above can be tempted then looking at overseas coaches, which would most likely be a stretch on our budget, maybe former player Steve Georgallis could be tempted to come over and prove himself like Justin Holbrook did with a view to getting a gig back in the NRL if he has success with us. His record does not look too crash hot since he took over at the Bulldogs this season but, having watched nearly every NRL game since the restart, the dogs have improved dramatically under his stewardship – and he has achieved that with a limited talent pool. He is being replaced by Trent Barrett at the end of the season and currently can’t get a gig as an assistant over in Aus so maybe an option.

The incoming coach will obviously have to take a look at the whole playing roster. However, whoever comes in is going to have to bring in the best organiser (Declan Patton is not the answer) we can afford as a priority signing and in order to do that there would have to be a few casualties.

Re the out of contract players, I would say thank you for their services to the club. Of the loanees, I would only be tempted to retain Battye if we can.

The positions which urgently need looking at are full back, half back and prop. We have assembled too many full backs at the club. Hampshire, a la Dufty at the Dragons, should be first choice with one of Walker or Jowitt in reserve – not both. Did not understand the Gigot signing but guess he has utility value across the back line – probably stuck there. OK with Miller as a running half but Jowitt or Declan Patton or Hampshire or Gigot are not the organising half back partner we need. At prop, we have got Fifita (if he stays) / Green / Battye (if he signs permanently). I like the look of Aydin but he needs time to develop and at the moment is a fifth/sixth choice prop.

For me, we need to say goodbye to the OOC players and loanees save for Battye and bring in one organising half and two more props.

We have a decent nucleus of players. We ‘just’ need a) a coach who can motivate, get the players fit and bring structure to our attack and defence and b) a decent organiser and strong captain to deliver all that on the field.

Sounds so easy but given finances...

Re: Room for manoeuvre. : Fri Sep 18, 2020 1:06 pm  

PopTart wrote:

Selling our best players is just a signpost to second division.
We need to keep the team together, trim the fat and get an organiser in to run the show on the field.

That's where were heading with our so-called best players what's the differanceold cockrr

Re: Room for manoeuvre. : Fri Sep 18, 2020 1:25 pm  

alegend wrote:

This is the problem with some of the Wakefield fans We can not get rid of Mr Chester who will take over.Bet the HKR fans are happy now Tony Smith is there ,Know I would be if he was at Wakefield .Think we should use a lot of next years cash for new players to go out and get the best coach we can .Think we are seeing Mr Chester wasted the money this year. So spend it on a Coach

I don't think any problems at this club are down to the Wakefield fans.

Re: Room for manoeuvre. : Fri Sep 18, 2020 1:28 pm  

I thought the consensus was that Chester isn't up to the job.
EG: We don't have any attacking structure,we don't have any defensive structure,Chester has lost the dressing room etc....
People have commented that we have talented players,the problem is that they aren't being coached effectively.

Therefore,no need for wholesale changes to the squad.
Find a new coach that (hopefully) can get the best out of the talent we have.
Let the new coach decide where we need to strengthen (including backroom).
We will all have opinions on where we think the key positions are that need strengthening,seems everyone agrees (even Chester himself) - we urgently need an on field General in the half backs.
Personally i would let the natural wastage (OOC and loan) run its course,but wouldn't rush into selling contracted players.

Re: Room for manoeuvre. : Fri Sep 18, 2020 1:32 pm  

little wayne69 wrote:

I don't think any problems at this club are down to the Wakefield fans.

You are absolutely correct the chairman or whatever he’s called now and the coach have received unbelievable support from the fans

Re: Room for manoeuvre. : Fri Sep 18, 2020 1:34 pm  

Eastern Wildcat wrote:

Out of the ones leaving, Brough hasn't been replaced properly, albeit Gigot coming in.

With Kirmo and Atkins, I would say that these were two of the bigger contracts, but aren't first choice. Most centres and second rows these days, players can fill these and be utilized in both, so you may get away with only replacing one. Didn't we also bring in a second rower, and immediately send him out on loan.

Also bearing in mind that the Fifita situation is now resolved, we don't know the full resolution of this just yet. He could be getting himself back to full fitness, or he could have been released, clearing budget, cap and quota space.

There is also the Toronto situation. If it goes pear shaped for TW, could there be a firesale of players. Aren't there two front rowers there who spent time on loan with us, putting in decent shifts.

For me, the Brough part of this, player wise, is the key.

I don't think Brough will be on as much as you think. I'm led to believe he left with a year remaining on his Huddersfield deal and signed a lower value two year deal with us for the the longer term security but with Hudds paying him 40K on top of his wage from us during that first year. After that it was just our lower salary. It'll not be buttons but won't free up masses. LIkewise Kirmond signed up for this year on less as a player but with a coaching role with the reserves to make up the extra. Given the reserves are on hold next year due to cost cutting i imagine that cash will disappear. Don't know about Atkins but as a last hurrah in superleague deal i doubt it would have been a fortune.

Personally i'd move Fifita on. He is our biggest earner and recent events haven't shown him in the best light. If Catalans want to take his wage on and chuck a bit of money in our direction then i'd snatch their hand off. As for TJ whether he would still want to go to the NRL given his upcoming change in personal circumstances i don't know but i doubt anyone in this country can afford a decent transfer fee this year so he might stay by default. But if he does want to go then in my opinion it wouldn't be right to stop him if the deal is good for us as well.

As for the OCC players i'd move the two 30-something's on. Given he is still young for a prop i might be tempted to keep Gwaze if the price is right with a view to getting him out on loan in the championship to see how he continues to develop.

Re: Room for manoeuvre. : Fri Sep 18, 2020 1:36 pm  

For me recruitment as been shocking not the standard of quality of players but the postions example we had/have 2 more than adiquit full backs but a walker signed then even though wd now have 3 gigot is signed for me those 2 signings wearnt needed

Re: Room for manoeuvre. : Fri Sep 18, 2020 1:43 pm  

TURFEDOUT wrote:

I thought the consensus was that Chester isn't up to the job.
EG: We don't have any attacking structure,we don't have any defensive structure,Chester has lost the dressing room etc....
People have commented that we have talented players,the problem is that they aren't being coached effectively.

Therefore,no need for wholesale changes to the squad.
Find a new coach that (hopefully) can get the best out of the talent we have.
Let the new coach decide where we need to strengthen (including backroom).
We will all have opinions on where we think the key positions are that need strengthening,seems everyone agrees (even Chester himself) - we urgently need an on field General in the half backs.
Personally i would let the natural wastage (OOC and loan) run its course,but wouldn't rush into selling contracted players.

No ones leading with the idea that we should sell our best players!

You’ve agreed that letting off contract players go and not yet replacing them is the right way to go also that loan agreements should expire, players go back to their parent club and we don’t replace them meaning their wages are saved.
That alone will create a bit of room for movement regarding the recruitment of some quality where it’s needed.

However, if a new Head Coach sees a high quality half back as a priority and the only way to raise the funds is to accept an offer from St George - Illawarra for TJ and Tom himself is thinking of going then the Head Coach should be the one who makes that call.
Cash in on TJ and sign Mitchell Pearce for example. Tom is a magnificent player but maybe recruiting a player like DCE, Pearce or Nikorima would be greater for the team than having a superb winger.

Like I said before, all hypothetical but let a new Head Coach have the money and make the big decisions on players in and out!