[Kosh]

: Tue Jun 09, 2009 2:35 pm  

Chris71 wrote:

I have heard that there is a group that are interested and have tried to buy the club previously before being stiffed on the deal.

If by "being stiffed on the deal" you mean "being unable or unwilling to pay the asking price" then yes. Or at least there was.

[Kosh]

: Tue Jun 09, 2009 2:36 pm  

Jake the Peg wrote:

And we have james rule

Actually we have no direct analogue for the role than McManus plays at Saints. Which is the main problem rather than the personalities involved.

: Tue Jun 09, 2009 2:41 pm  

Kosh wrote:

Actually we have no direct analogue for the role than McManus plays at Saints. Which is the main problem rather than the personalities involved.

mcmanus is their chief exec isn't he? Is he also the club's owner?

Problem with our club is that we have an inexperienced chief exec who has no authority to do anything anyway.

People point to the club going down the pan since cooke left. My take on it is that it was at that time that rule took over and this is the fundamental problem. plummer may not have been a great media person and he fooked up big style over cooke, however the club seemed to operate much better under his guidance

[Chris71]

: Tue Jun 09, 2009 3:02 pm  

Kosh wrote:

If by "being stiffed on the deal" you mean "being unable or unwilling to pay the asking price" then yes. Or at least there was.

No I mean being stiffed as in both parties agree on the price, then after the paperwork is drawn up the sellers decide to ask for more.

: Tue Jun 09, 2009 3:03 pm  

Chris71 wrote:

No I mean being stiffed as in both parties agree on the price, then after the paperwork is drawn up the sellers decide to ask for more.

Yeah, but to be fair, £20 and half a pack of bensons just doesn't buy you what it used to

: Tue Jun 09, 2009 5:45 pm  

Jake the Peg wrote:

mcmanus is their chief exec isn't he? Is he also the club's owner?

IIRC, McManus owns enough shares in the club to do what he likes. The guy is one smart cookie. For years he worked in Hong Kong buying and selling shares and gave up an extremely well paid job to take over St. Helens. The club has benefitted tremendously from his experience of the financial markets, methods and systems - especially in clearing what were pretty frightening debts. He's openly admitted that Saints is a labour of love rather than a means to secure a good living. I think you have to be a supporter for such a decision to make sense.

He also knows how the mind of the fan works. When Millward was sacked, for the first and only time the supporters turned against the board. Millward was clever in his ability to manipulate the media and the fans. He was very successful in portraying himself as the supporters' choice - an honest and highly decorated coach wounded by the cynical men upstairs. But McManus pulled a masterstroke in stepping onto the supporters' coach to talk with great and, at times, shocking honesty throughout the journey. It turned perceptions around in an eyeblink and mortally wounded Millward's reputation.

If you talk to McManus it's truly refreshing to listen to someone in charge of a club who is not afraid to discuss what other chief execs and chairmen simply refuse to go into.

Without doubt he is the club's greatest asset and the day he leaves will be a grim one indeed.

: Tue Jun 09, 2009 6:09 pm  

Mugwump wrote:

A good coach MIGHT be able to transform the on-the-field fortunes of the club for a short time. But for genuine positive change to occur and - more importantly - PREVAIL you need things right upstairs. If you have muppets at the top even Wayne Bennett would struggle past a second year.

Saints are extremely fortunate in having McManus. He's not in the David Whelan wealth bracket, but he has a few bob. Enough to clear the mountain of bad debts and bad faith left behind by the previous administration, which threatened to send Saints the same way as Widnes, Halifax and the rest. McManus has got the club off life-support, single-handedly driven the development of the new stadium through (ready some time in 2011 and owned by the club) and has financed the acquisition of world class talent (Gidley, Lyon, Cayless, Soliola etc.) without running up mind-boggling debt (as was the case with Newlove, Sculthorpe etc.).

But where McManus has REALLY delivered is in creating a comprehensive and cohesive strategy for Success at all levels. From the kit man through to the chairman - everyone understands his role within the machine and what the 'Big Picture' really is. No where is this more important than in the field of junior development. For years St. Helens was a laughing stock. Before Graham we hadn't produced a single top class prop in my living memory (excluding Andy Platt, who didn't come through the ranks as such). Now we have several excellent prospects following Graham (Clough may gravitate toward prop but at this moment he is an excellent young second row). In other positions we're practically awash with talent - Lomax, Ashurst, Eastmond, Wheeler, Ellis etc.

McManus hired the best people to develop the kids (special mention to Mike Rush, who has attracted interest from the RFL to become a national performance manager) and let them get on with it - provided they worked within the framework he developed to take the club forward.

Of course, none of the above guarantees success. Only a fool thinks his club will be at the top forever. But it DOES mean the club should - barring serious ill fortune (such as McManus keeling over dead and a lunatic like Maurice "Spend...Spend...Spend...and the banks be damned!" Lindsay taking over to run the club into the ground) - remain at the very least COMPETITIVE. And that's good enough even for the most fickle fans.

It does help,when a club hire Mick Potter ,who coached NSW under 18's,
therefore Saints have employed a guy,who has had proven experience
at bringing youngsters through at the top level - ie the elite of NSW.

We entrust a coach to offer tutelage to our youth whose only experience,was coaching an amateur team in Featherstone, and the mighty York City Knights

Who would you employ to bring the youth through,Potter or Agar??

: Tue Jun 09, 2009 6:10 pm  

Mugwump wrote:

IIRC, McManus owns enough shares in the club to do what he likes. The guy is one smart cookie. For years he worked in Hong Kong buying and selling shares and gave up an extremely well paid job to take over St. Helens. The club has benefitted tremendously from his experience of the financial markets, methods and systems - especially in clearing what were pretty frightening debts. He's openly admitted that Saints is a labour of love rather than a means to secure a good living. I think you have to be a supporter for such a decision to make sense.

He also knows how the mind of the fan works. When Millward was sacked, for the first and only time the supporters turned against the board. Millward was clever in his ability to manipulate the media and the fans. He was very successful in portraying himself as the supporters' choice - an honest and highly decorated coach wounded by the cynical men upstairs. But McManus pulled a masterstroke in stepping onto the supporters' coach to talk with great and, at times, shocking honesty throughout the journey. It turned perceptions around in an eyeblink and mortally wounded Millward's reputation.

If you talk to McManus it's truly refreshing to listen to someone in charge of a club who is not afraid to discuss what other chief execs and chairmen simply refuse to go into.

Without doubt he is the club's greatest asset and the day he leaves will be a grim one indeed.

Nice to know your owner is so in touch with the rank and file.Good post,makes interesting reading

: Tue Jun 09, 2009 7:22 pm  

Mugwump wrote:

IIRC, McManus owns enough shares in the club to do what he likes. The guy is one smart cookie. For years he worked in Hong Kong buying and selling shares and gave up an extremely well paid job to take over St. Helens. The club has benefitted tremendously from his experience of the financial markets, methods and systems - especially in clearing what were pretty frightening debts. He's openly admitted that Saints is a labour of love rather than a means to secure a good living. I think you have to be a supporter for such a decision to make sense.

He also knows how the mind of the fan works. When Millward was sacked, for the first and only time the supporters turned against the board. Millward was clever in his ability to manipulate the media and the fans. He was very successful in portraying himself as the supporters' choice - an honest and highly decorated coach wounded by the cynical men upstairs. But McManus pulled a masterstroke in stepping onto the supporters' coach to talk with great and, at times, shocking honesty throughout the journey. It turned perceptions around in an eyeblink and mortally wounded Millward's reputation.

If you talk to McManus it's truly refreshing to listen to someone in charge of a club who is not afraid to discuss what other chief execs and chairmen simply refuse to go into.

Without doubt he is the club's greatest asset and the day he leaves will be a grim one indeed.

last time rule spoke to the fans they all ended up falling over dizzy from his spin

: Wed Jun 10, 2009 7:58 am  

Mugwump wrote:

IIRC, McManus owns enough shares in the club to do what he likes. The guy is one smart cookie. For years he worked in Hong Kong buying and selling shares and gave up an extremely well paid job to take over St. Helens. The club has benefitted tremendously from his experience of the financial markets, methods and systems - especially in clearing what were pretty frightening debts. He's openly admitted that Saints is a labour of love rather than a means to secure a good living. I think you have to be a supporter for such a decision to make sense.

He also knows how the mind of the fan works. When Millward was sacked, for the first and only time the supporters turned against the board. Millward was clever in his ability to manipulate the media and the fans. He was very successful in portraying himself as the supporters' choice - an honest and highly decorated coach wounded by the cynical men upstairs. But McManus pulled a masterstroke in stepping onto the supporters' coach to talk with great and, at times, shocking honesty throughout the journey. It turned perceptions around in an eyeblink and mortally wounded Millward's reputation.

If you talk to McManus it's truly refreshing to listen to someone in charge of a club who is not afraid to discuss what other chief execs and chairmen simply refuse to go into.

Without doubt he is the club's greatest asset and the day he leaves will be a grim one indeed.

Was that when he went on the Stew's funbus and was the game at the KC against us?