Re: 3rd test disgrace! : Tue Nov 13, 2018 5:48 pm  

Grimmy wrote:

Fair enough. There does seem to be a culture where we are quiet when they do well and jump on them when they do badly though. I agree about Greenwood. With regards to Myler - I can understand that one to be honest. Bearing in mind we have Williams partnering him, I'd be more inclined to think he would be capable of leading the team round the park and having a good long kicking game rather than Lomax. The fact that Brown and Myler have played test rugby says more about our embarrassing lack of quality halfbacks than it does about Bennett. That goes back long before him to when we have had the likes of Sinfield, Sculthorpe and Horne doing a job there (having said that Sculthorpe did have that wonder game at stand off in 01 when we beat the aussies....)

I dont think Myler should be anywhere near the England team, injuries or not. What was he going to offer us? The only thing that he is remotely ok at is support play close to the line. I dont remember him actually doing any kicking to be honest so the idea that he was there to kick us around the park is a non starter (does he even have a kicking game?) It would of been much better to either play Ratchford or Lomax there as both are part of Englands future plans whilst Myler will be sat at home watching any future games on TV. We needed to win that game to show that the previous 2 wins were not just 'flash in the pans' but instead we treated it like a mess around and were made to look stupid on national TV.

Re: 3rd test disgrace! : Tue Nov 13, 2018 7:51 pm  

The_Enforcer wrote:

What the hell has going to any of the games got to do with observing the game? What is this, some kind of 'im better than you because i went' type of post?

I take it you think its a good idea to debut Greenwood in a position he has never played and does not have the build for? Likewise, i take it you think Richie Myler at 7 was a good idea when we had Lomax who had played in the halves all year for Saints and Ratchford who had played at 1 all year for Warrington and is no stranger to playing in the halves himself if need be? No Bennett chose a guy who has never been classed as a good player and has just come off the back of a season in which his team were awful.

Bennett is no master coach, he would be coaching Australia if he were so good. Just because hes won a few titles in Australia doesnt mean hes a genius who always makes the right decision. He has had the best players to play with for many years at the Broncos. Hes also the only Aussie coach to lose a WCC on home soil yet people like you think he can never be wrong and is the messiah.

Wayne Bennett is the greatest coach in the history of the game. Thats not my opinion thats a proven fact.

Re: 3rd test disgrace! : Tue Nov 13, 2018 9:27 pm  

JonnyBroad wrote:

Wayne Bennett is the greatest coach in the history of the game. Thats not my opinion thats a proven fact.

Proven as fact how? Who gets to decide hes the greatest coach ever?

Re: 3rd test disgrace! : Tue Nov 13, 2018 11:28 pm  

The_Enforcer wrote:

Proven as fact how? Who gets to decide hes the greatest coach ever?

One guy did try and you can read his assessment if you google -Is Wayne Bennett worthy of the title super coach?

The analysis was done in 2011(Bennett has won nothing in Aus clubland since) by a renowned Qld Uni professor who took a "sportenomics" approach. 8 key indicators were used to judge a super coach.

He concluded that 2 Aus coaches were ahead of him and Bennett ranked equal in the 2nd tier with Bobby Fulton.

Re: 3rd test disgrace! : Wed Nov 14, 2018 8:50 am  

The_Enforcer wrote:

Typical old England/GB. Unable to apply themselves. That was the perfect opportunity to show the world that England are a force but they used it as a training session/a bit of a muck around.

If i ever see Richie Myler playing for England/GB again ill know we are doomed. What an awful player. Why Bennett didnt move Lomax to 7 and put Ratchford at 1 ill never know. Even just swapping Tomkins with Ratchford would of been a mile better than bringing in Myler who IMO would even be out of his depth playing in the second division.

Both James Graham and Chris Hill are at the end of their peak and declining. Graham has looked like an old man throughout the series and Hill has also looked to be on the decline all year for Warrington and has looked well past his best for England this series. His missed tackle on Nikorima was pathetic at this level.

Milner, not International class sorry Cas fans, he offers nothing.

Greenwood, what the hell was Bennett doing playing him at prop when he had Thompson he could of picked there? Whitehead or even Bateman could of gone to 13 and Greenwood could of then played second row. It was obvious that Greenwood was going to get snapped in two down the middle as he just doesnt have the right build for that kind of work.

The Aussie ref. Allowed the Kiwis to lie on for what felt like an eternity for most of the game, then decided he wanted a fast PTB when we tried it and binned our player. What the hell? Lets not even mention the amount of high shots he just ignored.

Lastly, why not give us the shield last week? It looked crazy after we had just been hammered and nilled to then present us with the shield. Why didnt O'loughlin lift it with Graham? He was the official captain even if he did only take part in 12 minutes of the first game. Ive no idea what he found so funny, fair play to Graham for asking him time and time again to come and lift it with him. I thought the whole saga looked unprofessional as hell on live TV, like it was just some worthless shield.

Fair play to Lomax, Makinson, Williams, Bateman and Jermaine who all gave 100% to try and get the win.

TBH I don't disagree with any of this.
I thought the strength in depth in the England squad was wearing thin by the 3rd test

Re: 3rd test disgrace! : Wed Nov 14, 2018 9:33 am  

I think maybe Bennett is probably trying to find future combinations ,after all the series was won & SL is not exactly overrun with world class English players in any position. NZ showed what can happen when good players get the ball in space but i was disappointed with their McGuiresque spoiling tactics.

Re: 3rd test disgrace! : Wed Nov 14, 2018 9:55 am  

Nikorima and Johnson didn’t suddenly get better, our pack (due to personnel changes and the series being in the bag), allowed them to play better

Re: 3rd test disgrace! : Wed Nov 14, 2018 10:44 am  

The_Enforcer wrote:

A top flight coaching career spanning 32 years and he coached Australia for 2 years proves my point. If he was such a great coach, why did the Aussies not have him coaching the national team for more than 2 years? The truth is that he is regarded as some grand coaching wizard just because he stayed at the Broncos for 20 years. He wasnt even THAT successful there only winning 6 out of 20 Premierships despite having some of the best players in the NRL playing for the Broncos, the likes of Renouf, Webke, Langer, Lockyer, Sailor, Hancock, Tallis, Walters, Thorn, Lazarus etc. all at their prime. Id say 6 out of 20 premierships is a poor result with those kind of players and a so called genius coaching them.

Years Team Gms W D L W%
1986–88 Queensland 9 5 4 56
1997 QLD (SL) 3 1 0 2 33
1998 Australia 2 2 0 0 100
1998 Queensland 3 2 0 1 67
2001–03 Queensland 9 5 0 4 56
2004–05 Australia 14 10 1 3 71
2010–16 NRL All Stars 5 2 0 3 40
2016– England
Two spells not two years! can you name many other coaches that have won Six from twenty in the NRL in recent times?, almost one in three

Re: 3rd test disgrace! : Wed Nov 14, 2018 6:49 pm  

Won countless trophies with Brizzy
Won nrl with St George and world club
Improved Newcastle beyond belief nearly getting them to a gf if my memory serves me right.
Won trophies with Australia.
Won series with Queensland.
Masterminded New Zealand into winning the World cup.
Improved England to a level we havent been at for a long time.
I get that pepole dont like him and his demina but contary to belief all the players say he is totally different than he potrays himself to the public.
The guy is an out and out winner.

Re: 3rd test disgrace! : Thu Nov 15, 2018 11:41 am  

The_Enforcer wrote:

I dont remember him actually doing any kicking to be honest so the idea that he was there to kick us around the park is a non starter (does he even have a kicking game?) It would of been much better to either play Ratchford or Lomax there as both are part of Englands future plans whilst Myler will be sat at home watching any future games on TV.

Kicks in general play this year:
Myler - 129
Lomax - 29
Ratchford - 19

I'm not saying that Myler is a great scrum half, but I am saying he clearly does a lot of play kicking, and that is a massive part of international rugby, which is increasingly becoming about winning field position and forcing repeat sets. I could be wrong, but I don't think he will consider using a halfback with no kicking game. Otherwise they know they can just pressure Williams every time on last tackle, and that if he is off form with the boot we will have no plan B.