Re: Sonny bill : Sun Nov 10, 2019 6:57 pm  

Steph Curry wrote:

What has Widnes and Bradford’s demise got to do with Toronto?

Toronto have generated more interest in rugby league in 1 week than Wakefield have in 50 years. That’s why they are good for the game

Short memory Steph eh? In 1983 (LESS than 50 years ago), Trinity made an equally or more astounding, world newsworthy signing when they signed Wally Lewis. You must either be a young lass or Know little about the game!!

Re: Sonny bill : Sun Nov 10, 2019 6:59 pm  

[quote="Tommy Duckfingers"]Absolutely. Nowt stopping us from signing him or his ilk - other than the fact we haven't got a pot to mickey in.

Pretending that signing SBW is anything other huge for various reasons just smacks of jealousy and insecurity from some fans. Let's be right here, if we had just announced him signing for us then we'd all be over the moon and there'd be crusty socks everywhere.

Ultimately, if Toronto have got their plan wrong and they flop on the field then they'll be in a dog fight at the bottom of the league with, most probably, a few other teams. After all, we want matters to be decided on the park don't we? They've come through the leagues and earned their shot and I accept I'll be in a minority here but I hope they do really well.[/quote}

I for one wish we had signed him, the Toronto fans are lucky to have got him on board.
As far as Toronto are concerned, I appreciate what you are saying , but if the trend continues towards a possible international SL, where do you think that would leave the likes of us, Cas, and Hull KR etc?
I have nothing against Toronto playing RL, but they should do it in their own league. Just my opinion of course.

Re: Sonny bill : Sun Nov 10, 2019 7:45 pm  

Redscat wrote: Short memory Steph eh? In 1983 (LESS than 50 years ago), Trinity made an equally or more astounding, world newsworthy signing when they signed Wally Lewis. You must either be a young lass or Know little about the game!! It's even forgotten about by the media as well so you can't blame him https://www.skysports.com/rugby-league/ ... -transfers Makes you wonder did we ever sign the greatest rugby league player at all, little old Wakefield eh

Redscat wrote: Short memory Steph eh? In 1983 (LESS than 50 years ago), Trinity made an equally or more astounding, world newsworthy signing when they signed Wally Lewis. You must either be a young lass or Know little about the game!! It's even forgotten about by the media as well so you can't blame him https://www.skysports.com/rugby-league/ ... -transfers Makes you wonder did we ever sign the greatest rugby league player at all, little old Wakefield eh

Re: Sonny bill : Sun Nov 10, 2019 8:33 pm  

snowie wrote: It's even forgotten about by the media as well so you can't blame him https://www.skysports.com/rugby-league/ ... -transfers Makes you wonder did we ever sign the greatest rugby league player at all, little old Wakefield eh Makes you sick doesn't it, Snowie? There's unfashionable, and then there's Wakefield Trinity. By paying whatever they have for SBW's services have Toronto now set new levels of signing on fees for "world class" players??

snowie wrote: It's even forgotten about by the media as well so you can't blame him https://www.skysports.com/rugby-league/ ... -transfers Makes you wonder did we ever sign the greatest rugby league player at all, little old Wakefield eh Makes you sick doesn't it, Snowie? There's unfashionable, and then there's Wakefield Trinity. By paying whatever they have for SBW's services have Toronto now set new levels of signing on fees for "world class" players??

Re: Sonny bill : Sun Nov 10, 2019 9:16 pm  

Think we paid 8000 for Derek turner in 1959 big money in those days I bet he'd have given sonny bill a good game as well.

Re: Sonny bill : Mon Nov 11, 2019 6:30 pm  

PopTart wrote:

But no one in the heartlands has that money.
It isn't stopping anyone in the North of England doing anything they like.

Exactly so what you will have is a team full of clubs who will only be there if they have rich owners. What a joy. We'll get to watch the richest buy the mostest while clubs go to the wall that we all cherish and support - there you shall lose more fans than you will gain. The reason rugby league struggles is because historically it hasn't been able to retain the fans it already has. Some of the crowds Wakefield used to get makes our current attendances look like a joke. I've nothing against Toronto exisiting as a rugby league club - I have as a rugby league club in a competition based in Britain. Chucking obscene money at a player that is past his best rather than thwoing that amount of money at grassroots at Toronto and canadian rugby as a whole goes to show me that it's not so much expansion that is the motivator here. You need to as a sport show that you are worth more than other sports by getting young kids into the game, chucking ten million dollars at SBW is not the answer - it's an expensive gimmick. If this was about exposing more kids and families to the game, Toronto would have been far better off spending 10 million dollars on marketing or free tickets to kids and families who have never attended a rugby league game. You might get a few extra walk-ins of passive Rugby fans in to watch one game of the season but most people outside of Rugby don't know who SBW is. You need the power base and marketing in order to expand the game. I fear that there is some extreme naivety in some of the hyperbolic positive responses I've seen regarding this from Rugby League outlets. I'll be looking at attendance figures in the coming season extremely closely believe me. Is SBW going to be good to watch as a Rugby League fan? Yes. Is this going to be effective in making the game any better? Not for me. It might set a precedent for getting rid of the salary cap and trying to attract new teams to the league. New teams run by rich owners in an International Super League. Does that sound attractive? Not for me. I'm struggling to see any long-term planning or plan to improve Super League other than rolls of a dice and individual clubs paying extortionate amounts of dollars for players who are past it. TL:DR I don't see how Toronto spending that money improves the game overall? Unless they plan on throwing 100 million at 10 other top Aussies - oh wait, that wouldn't be improving the game either for young British players.

Re: Sonny bill : Mon Nov 11, 2019 7:09 pm  

Adam_Harrison9 wrote:

Exactly so what you will have is a team full of clubs who will only be there if they have rich owners. What a joy. We'll get to watch the richest buy the mostest while clubs go to the wall that we all cherish and support - there you shall lose more fans than you will gain. The reason Rugby League struggles is because histroically it hasn't been able to retain the fans it already has. Some of the crowds Wakefield used to get makes our current attendences look like a joke. I've nothing against Toronto exisiting as a Rugby League club - I have as a rugby league club in a competition based in Britain. Chucking obscene money at a player that is past his best rather than thwoing that amount of money at grassroots at Toronto and canadian rugby as a whole goes to show me that it's not so much expansion that is the motivator here. You need to as a sport show that you are worth more than other sports by getting young kids into the game, chucking ten million dollars at SBW is not the answer - it's an expensive gimmick. If this was about exposing more kids and families to the game, Toronto would have been far better off spending 10 million dollars on marketing or free tickets to kids and families who have never attended a Rugby League game. You might get a few extra walk-ins of passive Rugby fans in to watch one game of the season but most people outside of Rugby don't know who SBW is. You need the power base and marketing in order to expand the game. I fear that there is some extreme naivety in some of the hyperbolic positive responses I've seen regarding this from Rugby League outlets. I'll be looking at attendance figures in the coming season extremely closely believe me. Is SBW going to be good to watch as a Rugby League fan? Yes. Is this going to be effective in making the game any better? Not for me. It might set a precedent for getting rid of the salary cap and trying to attract new teams to the league. New teams run by rich owners in an International Super League. Does that sound attractive? Not for me. I'm struggling to see any long-term planning or plan to improve Super League other than rolls of a dice and individual clubs paying extortionate amounts of dollars for players who are past it. TL:DR I don't see how Toronto spending that money improves the game overall? Unless they plan on throwing 100 million at 10 other top Aussies - oh wait, that wouldn't be improving the game either for young British players.

Spot on Adam. Well said. I agree with every word.

Re: Sonny bill : Mon Nov 11, 2019 9:23 pm  

Adam_Harrison9 wrote:

Exactly so what you will have is a team full of clubs who will only be there if they have rich owners. What a joy. We'll get to watch the richest buy the mostest while clubs go to the wall that we all cherish and support - there you shall lose more fans than you will gain. The reason Rugby League struggles is because histroically it hasn't been able to retain the fans it already has. Some of the crowds Wakefield used to get makes our current attendences look like a joke. I've nothing against Toronto exisiting as a Rugby League club - I have as a rugby league club in a competition based in Britain. Chucking obscene money at a player that is past his best rather than thwoing that amount of money at grassroots at Toronto and canadian rugby as a whole goes to show me that it's not so much expansion that is the motivator here. You need to as a sport show that you are worth more than other sports by getting young kids into the game, chucking ten million dollars at SBW is not the answer - it's an expensive gimmick. If this was about exposing more kids and families to the game, Toronto would have been far better off spending 10 million dollars on marketing or free tickets to kids and families who have never attended a Rugby League game. You might get a few extra walk-ins of passive Rugby fans in to watch one game of the season but most people outside of Rugby don't know who SBW is. You need the power base and marketing in order to expand the game. I fear that there is some extreme naivety in some of the hyperbolic positive responses I've seen regarding this from Rugby League outlets. I'll be looking at attendance figures in the coming season extremely closely believe me. Is SBW going to be good to watch as a Rugby League fan? Yes. Is this going to be effective in making the game any better? Not for me. It might set a precedent for getting rid of the salary cap and trying to attract new teams to the league. New teams run by rich owners in an International Super League. Does that sound attractive? Not for me. I'm struggling to see any long-term planning or plan to improve Super League other than rolls of a dice and individual clubs paying extortionate amounts of dollars for players who are past it. TL:DR I don't see how Toronto spending that money improves the game overall? Unless they plan on throwing 100 million at 10 other top Aussies - oh wait, that wouldn't be improving the game either for young British players.

Can't argue with that mate. I've said it before, it's a shame Toulouse didn't have a backer or could have managed those crucial wins last season because that to me is the best natural expansion. With news of TV deals falling through for Catalans, if they'd have been promoted it would have been a real shot in the arm for French RL but also given the expansionists something to get their teeth into it, with the thought of another genuine derby and the chance to get more media interest across the channel, in an area with Junior development all the way up.

I had to laugh the other day when it was reported the SBW had been inquiring about his new house and where were the best places to live,thinking Tornto but nah, he was talking about Manchester because that's where they're based for months.
If you were to tell even the most open minded non RL fan, this idea that's come to fruition of a Toronto team started up by a billionaire backer and they're completely reliant on him, but they're playing in a European SL, plus what more, they can't play at home for a couple of months or whatever it is because it's too cold and the City won't let them because they need the stadium for other things. Then topped off by stuff like teams traveling over there and managing any effects of that. Then there grand media plan and main player brought into to keep them away from relegation is a 34 year old former great RL that's had to be gently nursed during the recent RU WC because he's had some pesky injuries. Oh aye the blokes on a yearly salary that's more than a whole SL team, I reckon you'd have to explain it a couple of times before they said, nah don't believe you pal.

Even though in the comparison I'm going to make there are plenty of differences from Toronto but generally there's a similar vibe with the NY Cosmos football team in the 70's when US football tried to become big time. The resemblance is a very rich man called Steve Ross - The world’s first media mogul had founded Warner Communications in 1971, whose catalogue boasted big names such as Barbra Streisand, Ray Charles and The Rolling Stones. Ross had ignited the cable television revolution, bought a company who launched the first ever video game console and helped integrate the comic book into the entertainment industry.Obviously the other similarity is they chucked a huge sum of money at him and was going to be the face for the team.

Ross bought out all the other Cosmos owners and wanted to create something big. With the team going nowhere fast infront of a few hundred people, Ross and the Cosmos team knew they needed something special to ignite interest in the team and in the NASL. That something special would be Pelé. Pele was at the back end of his career and had announced his retirement from his lifelong club Santos and in 1974 made the move to the USA. The reported deal was worth $4.5 million. This led to other stars moving over like Gordon Banks, Rodney Marsh, Geoff Hurst, Franz Beckenbauer, Carlos Alberto and George Best all graced the NASL.

Ateotd they enjoyed a few glory years when all the stars were there and the media were all over them and then Pele retired and the whole thing just fizzled out, to have to be all rebuilt years later.