Re: Brexit Anyone? : Tue Jun 21, 2016 11:13 pm  

Not read the whole thread but if you haven't please check out John Oliver's piece on Brexit! Real talk!

Re: Brexit Anyone? : Wed Jun 22, 2016 5:53 am  

sgtwilko wrote:

Not read the whole thread but if you haven't please check out John Oliver's piece on Brexit! Real talk!

I urge you all not too.

If you could all vote OUT it would be much appreciated as I'm moving back to the uk soon and a out vote would be very advantageous to the Aus dollar to pound exchange rate.

Re: Brexit Anyone? : Wed Jun 22, 2016 11:21 am  

Go to that well know video sharing site and search for 'Professor Michael Dougan on the EU referendum'.

Re: Brexit Anyone? : Wed Jun 22, 2016 7:06 pm  

If you in doubt go to that well-known video website and see Peter Shore's brief 1975 speech to the Oxford Union. Establishment arguments identical 41 years later but as Peter predicted our trade deficit with Europe has continued to grow from 2.4 billion pounds after a couple of years of membership to 100 billion pounds pa.

Re: Brexit Anyone? : Wed Jun 22, 2016 7:43 pm  

Dally wrote:

If you in doubt go to that well-known video website and see Peter Shore's brief 1975 speech to the Oxford Union. Establishment arguments identical 41 years later but as Peter predicted our trade deficit with Europe has continued to grow from 2.4 billion pounds after a couple of years of membership to 100 billion pounds pa.

By 100b did you mean 20b?

Nothing like a bit of exageration

Kind Regards

King james

Re: Brexit Anyone? : Wed Jun 22, 2016 8:10 pm  

Doom&Gloom Merchant wrote:

Lower paid jobs or not, they put more into the system than they take out of it.

Some do, some don't. If we were treating this sort of economic migration as err, well economic migration we'd want the former and not the latter.

The other problem with all these calculations is just how rigourously all the costs get factored in. Some of the cases that show overall net benefits from uncontrolled immigration conveniently assume it doesn't cost anything extra when you add more demand to certain services (at lunch today one of my colleagues remarked how brilliant NHS is because it's free, I was too polite to point out that it's not really free, it all has to be paid for even if it's not immediately obvious).

Re: Brexit Anyone? : Wed Jun 22, 2016 8:17 pm  

Lebron James wrote:

By 100b did you mean 20b?

Nothing like a bit of exageration

Kind Regards

King james

It was 23.9 billion pounds in the first 3 months of this year alone! Source: The Guardian, beloved of so many on here, quoting ONS stats.Of course we borrow to fund this and impoverish the country at an unsustainable rate. Our national debt is horrific for peace time. Yet our Chancellor thinks this is a marvellous state of affairs! The establishment are taking the p@ss out of stupid people.

Re: Brexit Anyone? : Wed Jun 22, 2016 8:22 pm  

bren2k wrote:

Yes we do need to address it - by funding the NHS properly, rather than imposing swingeing cuts to drive it to it's knees, then allowing the private sector to rescue it; which is exactly what Brexit poster boys Johnson and Gove will do, with Farage cheering them on from the fringes.

Immigration, or more accurately the *fear* of immigration, has been cynically used by the Leave campaign to explain away many of the ills of society; like it or not, it's a fact that EU migrants are net contributors to the UK economy. They do *not* get special status when it comes to social housing and they can't come here just to claim benefits. Several industries, including the NHS, would collapse without them. I don't disagree that infrastructure needs to keep up - but that's not a reason to leave the EU - it's a reason for the government to properly fund public services, which have been starved of money since the coalition government and remain so today.

As posted elsewhere the case that uncontrolled economic migration brings a net positive benefit is far from proven and becomes less and less convincing the more externalities get priced back into the analysis. But what is your economic argument to support UK taxpayers subsidising those economic migrants who take out more than they put in, given that we have no choice but to accept both productive and unproductive economic migration from the the EU?

Re: Brexit Anyone? : Wed Jun 22, 2016 8:33 pm  

Kelvin's Ferret wrote: As posted elsewhere the case that uncontrolled economic migration brings a net positive benefit is far from proven and becomes less and less convincing the more externalities get priced back into the analysis. But what is your economic argument to support UK taxpayers subsidising those economic migrants who take out more than they put in, given that we have no choice but to accept both productive and unproductive economic migration from the the EU? https://www.theguardian.com/uk-news/201 ... -ucl-study

Kelvin's Ferret wrote: As posted elsewhere the case that uncontrolled economic migration brings a net positive benefit is far from proven and becomes less and less convincing the more externalities get priced back into the analysis. But what is your economic argument to support UK taxpayers subsidising those economic migrants who take out more than they put in, given that we have no choice but to accept both productive and unproductive economic migration from the the EU? https://www.theguardian.com/uk-news/201 ... -ucl-study

Re: Brexit Anyone? : Wed Jun 22, 2016 9:01 pm  

As pointed out today by a caller to 5 live , in response to claims that it was lack of investment that was causing issues in the NHS and education , it was that with uncontrolled immigration how was it possible to budget with any sort of accuracy for the future

Essentially pointing out that immigration along with our ability to provide essential services was out of our control