Referee Bashing. : Mon Sep 02, 2019 4:37 pm  

The game has moved on dramatically since the days of Eric Clay and Billy Thompson etc..In those days there was no real scrutiny of refereeing decisions and in the main players and spectators alike had respect for the man in the middle.The game today is totally different with the move to “summer “and full time professional players who are much fitter and better coached.Every Super League game today is either televised or video recorded and as such every mistake by players or officials are highlighted.Mistakes by players seem to be soon forgotten even when they have proved costly to their team but when a referee makes a costly mistake he is pilloried .In the course of a game a referee has countless decisions to make and most of the time they get it right.
I was at Wakefield yesterday and there is no doubt that the referee made a few wrong decisions in what was a difficult game to officiate in.Likewise Robert Hicks I am certain will regret not asking for a video review of the Saints “Try”early in the Cup Final.Irrespective of the mistake he does not deserve the bashing being dished out by the Saints Chairman .Yes Hicks was wrong but so to is the Saints Chairman whose attack on Hicks is cowardly and I suspect it is one he will come to regret.There have been a few new referees coming through recently to challenge the established ones and given time hopefully the standard will improve.One to watch is Marcus Griffiths from Widnes who we have had a couple of times and who has done well.One that was lost to Super League was Jack Smith from Leigh does anyone know why ?as he always impressed .

Re: Referee Bashing. : Mon Sep 02, 2019 4:47 pm  

First thing I’d say is that EM was explicitly not bashing Hicks. He said as much. He was bashing the RFL’s decision to appoint Hicks in the circumstances.

In my humble opinion, EM shouldn’t have been so public in his complaints. That’s aside from the fact I think that if he did want to go public, then the programme notes were very poorly thought through and worded.

Clearly there is a point in there - that any sensible governing body would not have appointed the referee under these circumstances (can you imagine this situation occurring for an FA Cup final between two big clubs? No chance) - but I don’t appreciate the way we have gone about it.

It is all very unbecoming and not how I would want or expect our club to behave. Make your position known through the appropriate channels, pull yourself together and get on with shaping your own season rather than shifting blame.

That said - I think the standard of refereeing is pretty bad and the “refs call” aspect of the video ref breeds bad video ref decisions, although I can understand the rationale for it and that it has some merit.

Re: Referee Bashing. : Tue Sep 03, 2019 12:03 am  

FearTheVee wrote:

First thing I’d say is that EM was explicitly not bashing Hicks. He said as much. He was bashing the RFL’s decision to appoint Hicks in the circumstances.

Really? And complaining about Hicks officiating is not a slur on his integrity?

Re: Referee Bashing. : Tue Sep 03, 2019 12:53 am  

FearTheVee wrote:

First thing I’d say is that EM was explicitly not bashing Hicks. He said as much. He was bashing the RFL’s decision to appoint Hicks in the circumstances.

In my humble opinion, EM shouldn’t have been so public in his complaints. That’s aside from the fact I think that if he did want to go public, then the programme notes were very poorly thought through and worded.

Clearly there is a point in there - that any sensible governing body would not have appointed the referee under these circumstances (can you imagine this situation occurring for an FA Cup final between two big clubs? No chance) - but I don’t appreciate the way we have gone about it.

It is all very unbecoming and not how I would want or expect our club to behave. Make your position known through the appropriate channels, pull yourself together and get on with shaping your own season rather than shifting blame.

That said - I think the standard of refereeing is pretty bad and the “refs call” aspect of the video ref breeds bad video ref decisions, although I can understand the rationale for it and that it has some merit.

I understand that he felt he had grievances but, as you say, he went about this all wrong. His wording too was ill advised.

What really concerns me, though, is that these comments appeared in print just 5 working days after the events took place. I wouldn't claim to know the printing schedule for Saints programmes but even a generous estimate would suggest they would need a day to print meaning the copy would probably need to be in, say, by the Wednesday? That means he must have been writing this piece on or around the Tuesday.

Not only does this show poor restraint from your chairman but it also pretty much negates the hypothesis that some are putting forward that it was born of frustration as result of the RFL's inaction. He surely couldn't have expected any sort of response, let alone resolution, in just 2 days, could he?

I can't think that there's anyone in Rugby league who is satisfied with the current standard of refereeing. Maybe the game is simply too quick for just one ref. However the solution is not to publicly castigate officials in public, whatever the grievance.

Re: Referee Bashing. : Tue Sep 03, 2019 6:36 am  

I feel that both Eamon McManus and Chris Chester have let themselves down badly in the last few days.

Prior to this, both came over as affable and fair-minded characters, who, if they ever felt royally peeved, would exercise restraint and discretion and thus maintain their dignity.

Things are slightly different now.

Fans can slam referees, and regularly do regardless of the referee's performance ... but that's because no one really cares what the individual fan thinks, and therefore no one bothers to point out to him that lots of other factors also played into his team's defeat (such as bad play, poor coaching, maybe even poor chairmanship).

Officials - like coaches and chairmen - need to be a lot more careful. When they do it, it never looks like anything other than sour grapes. It also makes them look stupid (either willfully or otherwise) for failing to recognise those other failures, which might well be their own.

I used to have a bit of time for EM and CT. Now they're on a par with the Daryl Powells and Paul Andersons of this world.

Re: Referee Bashing. : Tue Sep 03, 2019 7:38 am  

Anything that happens at the top end of the game filters down VERY quickly. The junior game will be impacted by this spate of referee criticism. It's the young lad who quits reffing after getting stick in his 3rd U13 game that will be the main victim of this.

Re: Referee Bashing. : Tue Sep 03, 2019 7:42 am  

moto748 wrote:

Really? And complaining about Hicks officiating is not a slur on his integrity?

I don't think you've read the piece correctly if that was your take on it.

I would repeat I don't agree with the approach taken by EM, but his complaint was not directed at Hicks, it was directed at the RFL for putting him in a position where any bad/inexplicable decisions made could be questioned by both sides in a way that would not be the case for any other referee.

It was just a daft appointment, but that doesn't make EM's public tirades any more acceptable to me.

Re: Referee Bashing. : Tue Sep 03, 2019 9:41 am  

Macmanus has brought the game and his club into disrepute through his very ill advised words,paint it anyway you want that was an attack on Robert hicks..then the rfl,it will filter down to the lower leagues,he should be censured for his ill advised words,if he had a gripe,first take up with the coach,Hicks didn’t create that insipid Saints performance.

I’m tired of the constant attack’s on refs,it’s got beyond tedious now,both Mac the knife and Cheery Chester should shut up and look at your own team first before,boringly having a go at the ref.

Shame on Bobby Elstone for not putting his head above the parapet and condemning Manmanus diatribe,too busy looking for curtains for his new office no doubt,but credit to Brian Carey for shining the light on this issue too.

Re: Referee Bashing. : Tue Sep 03, 2019 10:55 am  

If you want to see "reaction" watch a recording of Sam Powells try on Sunday. A woman comes running from halfway up the stand behind the posts to shout at the referee.
I suppose the exercise did her good.

Re: Referee Bashing. : Tue Sep 03, 2019 11:08 am  

hengirl wrote:

Macmanus has brought the game and his club into disrepute through his very ill advised words,paint it anyway you want that was an attack on Robert hicks..then the rfl,it will filter down to the lower leagues,he should be censured for his ill advised words,if he had a gripe,first take up with the coach,Hicks didn’t create that insipid Saints performance.

I’m tired of the constant attack’s on refs,it’s got beyond tedious now,both Mac the knife and Cheery Chester should shut up and look at your own team first before,boringly having a go at the ref.

Shame on Bobby Elstone for not putting his head above the parapet and condemning Manmanus diatribe,too busy looking for curtains for his new office no doubt,but credit to Brian Carey for shining the light on this issue too.

Guess the coach:

"I was really disappointed about that. I was proud of the boys, they were courageous, the better side for 60 minutes and that decision flipped the game on its head. Where are we heading, talking about players welfare, and the decision was a knock-on? When do you get a penalty?

It wasn't intentional, but it's a crusher tackle, it's a penalty every day of the week.

We get the penalty, we got to 10-8 and I think we win the game.

That flipped the game. Even if he didn't give the penalty, it should have been our ball."